Greenhut Shoots. Greenhut Scores!

Intelligent. And handsome, too.

There’s always lots of talk in Orange County about freedom-loving him, or freedom-loving her, when the repuglicans start trumpeting some mediocre authoritarian hack or other for political office.

But then there’s the real deal – former OC Register writer and now occasional columnist, Steve Greenhut. Enjoy Steve’s opinion piece on the Kelly Thomas killing and the Fullerton Recall, here.

Greenhut is hitting on all cylinders. He gets it: there’s serial police abuse, secrecy and subsequent cover-ups by the politicians; there’s Redevelopment abuse, cronyism, and unaccountability; there’s an illegal tax on our water, 15 years-old, that has misdirected over $27,000,000 to pay for perks and pensions of the politicians and bureaucrats in City Hall.

The best part of Steve’s broadside is this part where he goes after the pusillanimous Register Editorial Board that has hypocritically succumbed to pressure applied by Dick Ackerman, Inc.:

Unfortunately, the Register Editorial Board didn’t fully support this heart-felt political revolt, as it argued, “The citizens who voted [the three councilmen] in and now are disgruntled should vote them out during a regular election cycle.” The Register had no such qualms about backing the recall in 2003 of Gov. Gray Davis, for similar lack-of-leadership reasons.

And finally Greenhut sums up with:

The release of the video reinforces the wisdom of the recall. A recent news article explained that “legal experts caution that the footage doesn’t tell the entire story,” but we don’t need experts to tell us the truth, now obvious to anyone who can access YouTube. And we don’t need experts to tell Fullerton voters what to do about three councilmen who acted in a craven and unconscionable way.

Oh, yes. We’ll let “the justice system unfold,” in the clumsy phraseology of our feckless Mayor, Sharon Quirk. In the meantime we’ll apply our our God-given commonsense to the facts that we are permitted to see by our political masters. And then we’ll recall the the bums.

 

About Us Behind Closed Doors Dick Jones Don Bankhead Home Town Hero MSM Falls on Face Patdown Pat McPension Repuglicanism Sharon Quirk The Crime Beat The Culture of Corruption The Fullerton Recall

66 thoughts on “Greenhut Shoots. Greenhut Scores!

  1. Great article that deserves a posting of it’s own…
    In your face Mayor Quirk and McKinley who’s only public comments since the preliminary trial showing of the video was “Let justice take it’s course” (paraphrasing).
    As one previously stated, we don’t need a jury of 12 to tell us who was guilty and what they are guilty of.

  2. Thanks for the great article. True justice for fullerton will be when there is change not just discipinary action whatever that may be. We can accomplish much when we all do are part however small that may be.

  3. I wish Steve Greenhut would run for office. He is smart dedicated and knows what it means to be an American.

    Steve Greenhut for Supervisor!

  4. Read about California facing a $16b budget shortfall. Possible cuts to schools and “public safety”?
    Save the schools, do away with “public safety” agencies such as FPD.

    1. Two words;

      >>> PENSION REFORM <<<<<

      1) We do not need more taxes.

      2) pensions should be funded on REAL state income, not projected budgets.

      3) Stop the retiring at 50, unless all Americans can retire and collect Social Security at 50.

      4) Stop the double dipping of pensions.
      ONE, "1", pension per person.

      One social security card is issued regardless of earnings, so in fairness, only one pension per person should be allowed, IMHO.

  5. HOW to prevent this kind of Stuff: Stop it in its tracks, a more rock-solid firing Authority to the

    Police Chief and all the top brass, maybe
    even down to the supervisor Lt. TO: all street cops: YOU WILL BE FIRED without a 1-year-long court Due Process, just like most private employers use ( “at will” employment). Especially in a case like the Mr. Kelly Thomas Death, Fullerton, Calif.

  6. Back again. Check out the News and Views section in Jim Marrs’ web site. Great article titled “A Policeman’s Lot” posted April 29th. Takes a few minutes to read; what the author says is very disturbing.

  7. Mr. Greenhut, That about sums it up. Thank you.

    There’s your malfeasance, Molly (and of the grossest kind)

  8. Look up the definition of “unflinching” and you’ll see Steven

    Greenhut’s picture there next to that word in the dictionary.

    1. Tokers everywhere like Steve. He understands the epic stupidity of the War against Drugs. A war which mainly benefits cops and prison guards.

  9. written by zima rusty fullerton from OC Register
    “it would be unreasonable to connect Ramos’ actions towards Kelly Thomas to Fullerton city council person if not for the presence of Pat McKinley. McKinley was Fullerton’s police chief from 1993 to 2009. His leadership corrupted a police force into a gang of thugs with his philosophy of us (Fullerton PD) versus them. Under McKinley’s watch, the docile, bedroom community of Fullerton was seen as the enemy to Fullerton PD and were not treated as persons with civil rights, only as combatants. McKinley’s legacy as police chief gave the community of Fullerton beatings, perjury, molestation of female detainees and murder. Ironically, while serving as Fullerton’s police chief, McKinley also served as the only member of the Orange County Human Relations Commission(OCHRC) headed by another Fullerton resident, Rusty Kennedy. Ironic because the tax supported OCHRC acts as a clearinghouse and mediator for OC communities’ complaints of civil rights abuses committed upon them by their respective police departments. It was not the OCHRC that informed the public Fullerton PD systematically abused the civil rights of Fullerton’s community but private citizen Tony Bushala’s blogsite, Friends For Fullerton Future.
    McKinley’s actions as Fullerton city council person shows the same behavior he exhibited when he was Fullerton’s police chief; lie to the community of Fullerton to better manipulate them, and at all costs(to the taxpayer) protect his hand-picked, personally trained goon squad.
    Ramos, Cicinelli, Wolfe et al believed that no matter how outrageous their actions, Mckinley protected them when he was their chief and he would protect them more as a Fullerton city council member.

  10. The war on drugs, HO HO HO. It might have been winnable but somehow bureaucracy got in the way.
    Greenhut’s opinion piece was excellent. Unfortunately, I received my ballot yesterday and see that Ms. Quirk Silva is running for state assembly. Now that is crassness. She does nothing on the Fullerton City Council but thinks she deserves to do nothing in the state assembly! Whew! At least she isn’t one of the three blind dinosaurs!

      1. I’m not sure they are “big” for assembly members any longer; I kind of recall it’s either nothing or very minimal given her possible STRS membership (teachers’ version of PERS).

    1. The war on drugs is structurally unwinable. Demand is permanent, supply is elastic, prohibition boosts profits for black markets. Thus was it ever, this will it always be.

  11. Steven Greenhut’s blog told me that he is willing to tell the truth even when it might risk his own personal financial gain. That’s balls, folks. His columns still appear in the OC Register to this day. Obviously, Steven is willing to burn those bridges. God bless him. There are very few people in your community who are willing to do the same. Even those who CLAIM to be for all things good – but make back door deals that contradict the integrity that they claim to represent. Only when we have more people follow Steven Greenhut’s example will our society began to turn around and restore integrity, honor and justice.

    Thank you, Steven Greenhut. You made my day, sir!!!

  12. Btw, Steven Greenhut – please run for the next open OC Supervisor’s seat. If it’s not in my district I will move just to vote for you!!!

    You are a good journalist. You would make an even better politician. And I think you would be incorruptible. I could say that about only 2% of our entire population in 2012.

  13. van get it da artiste :written by zima rusty fullerton from OC Register“it would be unreasonable to connect Ramos’ actions towards Kelly Thomas to Fullerton city council person if not for the presence of Pat McKinley. McKinley was Fullerton’s police chief from 1993 to 2009. His leadership corrupted a police force into a gang of thugs with his philosophy of us (Fullerton PD) versus them. Under McKinley’s watch, the docile, bedroom community of Fullerton was seen as the enemy to Fullerton PD and were not treated as persons with civil rights, only as combatants. McKinley’s legacy as police chief gave the community of Fullerton beatings, perjury, molestation of female detainees and murder. Ironically, while serving as Fullerton’s police chief, McKinley also served as the only member of the Orange County Human Relations Commission(OCHRC) headed by another Fullerton resident, Rusty Kennedy. Ironic because the tax supported OCHRC acts as a clearinghouse and mediator for OC communities’ complaints of civil rights abuses committed upon them by their respective police departments. It was not the OCHRC that informed the public Fullerton PD systematically abused the civil rights of Fullerton’s community but private citizen Tony Bushala’s blogsite, Friends For Fullerton Future.McKinley’s actions as Fullerton city council person shows the same behavior he exhibited when he was Fullerton’s police chief; lie to the community of Fullerton to better manipulate them, and at all costs(to the taxpayer) protect his hand-picked, personally trained goon squad.Ramos, Cicinelli, Wolfe et al believed that no matter how outrageous their actions, Mckinley protected them when he was their chief and he would protect them more as a Fullerton city council member.

    Well said and well read…

  14. Oh, is it any surprise that the Union Tribune is reportedly negotiating with Freedom Communications to buyout the OC Register. Hey, IMO the reporting at the Register could not get any worse. Their subscription base has fallen off the cliff. The majority of reporters are far-left radicals in libertarian clothing who support socialism. So I applaud any buyout. Anything but the status quo. I would support a Huffington Post parent company to what exists today. At least I’d know what I was dealing with then. There would be no question that liberals and facists were running the show. At least some integrity would get restored.

    1. Well, two of their reporters got hired on as pay-per-word hacks for the unions. The end is nigh for the Register.

    2. The Register is full of far-left radicals? No, Lou Ponzi is not a far-left radical. Just another middle-of-the-road corporate centrist. PS. Most fascists are conservatives -of the law and order variety.

      1. The Register is full of far-left radicals? No, Lou Ponzi is not a far-left radical. Just another middle-of-the-road corporate centrist. PS. Most fascists are conservatives -of the law and order variety.

        Ladies and gentlemen I present the classic politically brainwashed dolt who is only capable of seeing life as left vs. right and conservatives vs liberals.

        These dimwits are incapable of tying their own shoes until someone presents the objective in left or right wing point of view.

        I’m sick of this non-sense.

        1. Dyslexia much? I was responding to JustUs who is the person who brought this up in referring to the OC Register as left, which is take your pick: clueless, moronic, or insane. As is your rejoinder. Though in your case, I’m gong with moronic.

          The main political dynamic underway today is corporate-authoritarian-centrism (Obama, Romney, Bush, OC Register) versus anarchist-libertarian-freethinker-whatever (Greenhut, most of the smart people on this blog). You’re evidently in the 1950s communist-under-every-pillow camp. People like you will hurt any movement for change or reform because YOU are the one so hell-bent on arguing against a left-ideology which you could neither identify if it hit you in your mug, or understand. That’s why morons like you call Obama a socialist when he’s clearly a corporatist-centrist. Fascism is a product of the right; its equal on the left is totalitarian communism, and I despise both – but that doesn’t mean they’re the same ideologically or historically. Words and their meanings matter. We have enough illiterate cops on the board, we don’t need illiterate reformers as well.
          Get it?

          Political Science 101 over. Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

          1. Obviously you don’t read the OC Register much, JT?

            Support for illegal immigration is a far-left cause. Have you noticed all the far-left articles in support of illegal immigration in the Register? Not even the Editorial Board will touch it with a 50 foot pole. They either avoid it completely or say we need comprehensive reform (code phrase for AMNESTY).

            The Register also constantly published biased articles in favor of the teacher’s and their unions, especially when the elections roll around and it’s time to vote on higher taxes to pay those big teacher salaries and pensions. Supporting public unions is totally liberal.

            To to call the Register a ‘conservative’ newspaper is totally off the mark. It might have been in days gone by – but not anymore.

            BTW, apparently you don’t know much about ‘fascism’. Hitler was one of the biggest fascists of modern history and he ran a socialist government. What do you think the acronym NAZI stands for? Go look it up. You may learn something.

            1. “Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power.”
              – Benito Mussolini

              “Fascism may be defined as a form of political behavior marked by obsessive preoccupation with community decline, humiliation or victimhood and by compensatory cults of unity, energy and purity, in which a massed-based party of committed nationalist militants, working in uneasy but effective collaboration with traditional elites, abandons democratic liberties and pursues with redemptive violence and without ethical or legal restraints goals of internal cleansing and external expansion.” – Robert Paxton

              Illegal immigration – why don’t you read the Libertarian Party’s position on it here: http://www.lp.org/issues/immigration I think they get it about right. Especially the part about when laws are constantly being broken they probably shouldn’t be laws to begin with..

              Public Unions support plenty of Republicans. The worst of them are the prison guard unions and the cops. look how much money they gave to Conservative governors: http://ordinary-gentlemen.com/blog/2011/06/05/the-role-of-the-prison-guards-union-in-californias-troubled-prison-system/ They give money to the Dems too. The teachers unions – whatever. The cops and prison guard union – major problem. Teachers don’t carry guns or lobby to get more people locked up in jail for victimless crimes. Its all about priorities.

              Your problem is how you define the words liberal and conservative. You think Ron Paul (whom I support) is insufficiently conservative and everybody to the left of some imaginary standard you’ve created is thus liberal.

              Despite that, you’ve written some good stuff on here and we’re on the same page on the cops and the recall, so let’s just agree to disagree about ideology. But if you want reform in Fullerton its going to have to be bipartisan and pissing off every liberal, lefty, or progressive in town is just dumb. Stay tuned for more on that.

              1. JT, “fascism” is nothing more than the merger of state and corporate powers. Obama is said to be a ‘liberal’ – and this merger between state and corporate powers has been signed, sealed and delivered by him.

                So to conclude that “fascism” is a conservative ideology is plain nuts. Some of the biggest fascists the world has ever seen were liberals and socialists.

                “Illegal immigration – why don’t you read the Libertarian Party’s position on it here: http://www.lp.org/issues/immigration I think they get it about right. Especially the part about when laws are constantly being broken they probably shouldn’t be laws to begin with..”

                You’re wrong there, JT. When laws are constantly OVERLOOKED it’s called selective anarchy. Obama is fighting to allow illegal migrants to flood into Arizona and, at the same time, to prevent the Arizonans from doing anything about it. In fact, he sued them for trying to protect themselves. On the other hand, Obama has refused to sue any of the dozens of sanctuary cities that have defiantly violated FEDERAL immigration laws for decades. That is called SELECTIVE ANARCHY. So let’s call it all what it is, JT.

                “Public Unions support plenty of Republicans”

                Stop it, JT. Don’t be disingenuous. You’ll lose credibility. All know that it is primarily LIBERALS who support public unions. The OC Register articles have shown great bias in favor of teacher’s unions – which is a LIBERAL charactertic.

                So calling the OC Register ‘conservative’ is flawed. I just proved it to you.

                1. Agree on fascism and Obama. Fascism can swing more left and more right (Pinochet was no leftist, neither is the World Anti Communist league. Look them up).

                  You disagree with the Libertarian party on illegal immigration. Fine, your opinion. But that doesn’t make the Libertarian party socialist now does it. See my point? You’re just labeling things you don’t like as being liberal, socialist or leftist, even when the Libertarian party espouses them! Anyway illegal immigration has nothing to do with what we’re talking about here everyday on FFFF.

                  Public Unions – did you see how much money they gave Pete Wilson? Cops – you really think cop unions support is all liberals? Did you notice that Scott Walker EXEMPTED the police unions from his collective bargaining ban?

                  Look at the history of votes on drugs or civil liberties. Who brought us the War on Drugs? The Patriot Act? Guantanamo? Torture? LAW AND ORDER REPUBLICANS my friend. And even though you like calling anybody you want liberals, they don’t call themselves that and nobody else does either.

                  I’m not defending Obama or any centrists from any party, obviously. But blaming all the evils of the world on liberals is so historically inaccurate it makes you look like a Jonestown cult member.

                  Again, you don’t get it just define how you’d like the terms liberal and conservative to be used. The OC Register is a conservative paper. Liberalism in the US is largely dead anyway. Clinton and Obama killed it.

          2. People like you will hurt any movement for change or reform because YOU are the one so hell-bent on arguing against a left-ideology which you could neither identify if it hit you in your mug, or understand.

            What the hell are you babbling about?

            WAKE UP! SNAP OUT OF IT!

            That’s why morons like you call Obama a socialist when he’s clearly a corporatist-centrist.

            Where the hell did you get that from what I said earlier?

            I swear American politics is turning into a damn cult movement.

            1. I’m a person who is all about building coalitions between left and right against the corporate-state center. So you saying I see everything as left vs. right is just 180 degrees from the truth. You just assumed because I said Lou Ponsi is no leftist that “I view everything in left vs right terms.” No, I just believe in truth in advertizing, dimwit.

              Where the hell did you get any of what you wrote from anything I wrote? I just call things what they are. Calling the OC Register left just means you don’t know what left is. Let me show you: http://www.counterpunch.org – now that’s left. OC Register is middle of the road law and order Republican.

              Left and right are going to have to work together to get things done. People of any ideology can see that police brutality is out of control and needs to be stopped. That’s the bottom line. If you agree, then quit arguing. If you don’t, welcome to irrelevancy.

              1. I’m a person who is all about building coalitions between left and right against the corporate-state center.

                OH MY You’re seriously stuck in your left/right bubble. This is just plain sick.

                I just call things what they are.

                No, you’re creating your own little reality because I never said anything you claimed I said.

                Left and right are going to have to work together to get things done.

                God damn it! Its like you’re talking about two different species. YOU DON’T HAVE TO BE LOCKED DOWN IN YOUR BACKWARDS TRIBAL LEFT/RIGHT WORLD TO SEE POLICE BRUTALITY IS WRONG!

                This is a basic human rights issue not some stupid football game.

                It’s like saying “Well, gee I don’t know what to think of the Kelly Thomas beating until I know which team Kelly and the officers supported going to the Superbowl last year.”

                WAKE THE HELL UP! ITS NOT A GAME!

                People [Removed boilerplate BS] can see that police brutality is out of control and needs to be stopped. That’s the bottom line.

                NO SHIT!

                1. While I would like to respect Chris Thompson’s earlier admonition against swearing, you are such a stupid fucking moron its impossible in this instance. Left and right exist – I didn’t make them up. People identify themselves that way – its not me that’s so into doing that, it was the post I responded to that invoked those distinctions by saying the OC Register was “leftist.” THAT’S WHAT STARTED THE ARGUMENT YOU DYSLEXIC WINDBAG!. You’re so fucking obtuse you can’t even figure out we’re on the same side. I hate to say you’re making John Doe look intelligent at this point.

                2. Left and right exist

                  You suddenly remind me of this guy.

                  People identify themselves that way – its not me that’s so into doing that

                  The problem is not with people who identify themselves as left or right, the problem is people who live their lives in a left vs. right bubble and are incapable of functioning unless reality fits within that tight little bubble.

                  Sadly most of these people are easily manipulated and incapable of having true human feelings/emotions unless their party leaders tell them too. If that isnt cultish I don’t know what is.

                  You’re so fucking obtuse you can’t even figure out we’re on the same side.

                  There you go again with “sides”. You seriously have a problem.

      1. Lol funny when the post gets deleted and all the responses stay. Looks like you and Jane are hallucinating.

        1. If this is one way you get your jollies, then have a good time.

          You have been wrong all along. We can see for ourselves what’s what; we don’t need your interpretation of police work.

  15. I think that it’s important to note that Kelly Thomas may not have been an anomaly when it came to how the FPD dealt with their homeless population.

    How many other Kelly Thomas’s have their been over the years that wore out their welcome in Fullerton?

    The Fire Department Captain/paramedic testified that he was responding to a call for “person down with police involvement”, yet he chose to tend to the minor scrapes of the officers first with alcohol swipes.

    The paramedic also testified that not one of the officers rendered any sort of first aid to Kelly after the beating.

    The only aid that Kelly was given was an EKG monitor and a gratuitous ride to the hospital.

    1. From this you think the fire department is complicit in Kelly’s death? Really?

      As somebody who was there, I already told you that the fire department did not see or know about Kelly when they first pulled up. One of the squad cars blocked their view of him lying on the ground, and as we’ve all heard, the officers on the scene wanted their minor injuries examined first.

      It is obvious from the tape the officers did not back away or clear a path when the fire department arrived, so without seeing Kelly or being told about him, how would they know he is there?

      1. Let’s see if I’ve got this right. Paramedics roll up and fail to spot the body lying in a pool of blood on the concrete. The cops were not blocking the view.

        Having said that, I’m not going to accuse the FFD of killing Kelly Thomas; just adding to the general cavalier atmosphere of disregard. After all, Manny had a boo boo on his elbow that was all owie.

        1. http://www.fullertonsfuture.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Kelly-Thomas-Crime-Scene-01.jpg

          Kelly was on the ground beside the police car on the right. You can see where the fire engine stopped. They barely stepped off the engine when the police asked the medics to examine their own injuries. Contributing to the delay is the fact none of the police officers were huddled over Kelly, everybody was standing around nonchalantly.

          Go back in the tape.
          At 25:45 medics walk up and Cicinelli directs them to look at other officers, not Kelly. Not until 26:22 does one of the medics realize Kelly is lying there on the ground.

  16. Update re: state senate and assembly pensions –

    Administered by CalPERS, the Legislators’ Retirement System (LRS) was established in 1947 and covers members of the Legislature serving prior to November 7, 1990, elected Constitutional Officers, and Legislative Statutory Officers. (Under Proposition 140, members of the Senate and Assembly first elected on or after November 7, 1990 participate in the federal Social Security program and no other retirement system.)

    IF Q-S wins, she has no Assembly service-based pension entitlement; as an aside, should Mr. Diamond win his State Senate race, neither would he.

    1. Diamond would have a better shot at the heavyweight title.

      Quirk is finished in politics come November and good riddance. She was never any better than the dimwit Keller.

      1. I have to admit that seeing Mr Diamond “in the flesh” was a surprise; I had an entirely different mental image of him…

  17. Oddball question but does anyone know if any kind of permit has been issued so that PUBLIC parking can be denied to the public and used for private valet service? This needs to stop, whether it’s being done illegally or by permit to benefit such businesses as Slimebar et al.

    1. That public parking being used as a for-profit valet service outside of all the bars that are politically connected here in Fullerton has been a burr in my saddle too SherBear.

    2. Fullerton Lover, we need to look into it, starting with who authorized it and go from there.

      If any candidates care to respond and look into it, please do and get back to me. Several of you have my contact info.

      1. If anyone out there can divulge how public parking next to the bars in downtown Fullerton got Shanghaied by the for-profit valet service, it would be greatly appreciated by us all.

  18. They say everything comes out in the wash. Slidebar owner Jeremy Popoff insists he knows for a fact the call alerting police to the transit center did not originate from his establishment……..Poetic justice for him might be the elimination of valet service on public property, which aids his establishment. And let’s not forget the noise ordinance his establishment regularly violates.
    You are not out of the woods by a long shot, Mr. Popoff.
    Remember, everything comes out in the wash.

  19. Jt :Agree on fascism and Obama. Fascism can swing more left and more right (Pinochet was no leftist, neither is the World Anti Communist league. Look them up).
    You disagree with the Libertarian party on illegal immigration. Fine, your opinion. But that doesn’t make the Libertarian party socialist now does it. See my point? You’re just labeling things you don’t like as being liberal, socialist or leftist, even when the Libertarian party espouses them! Anyway illegal immigration has nothing to do with what we’re talking about here everyday on FFFF.
    Public Unions – did you see how much money they gave Pete Wilson? Cops – you really think cop unions support is all liberals? Did you notice that Scott Walker EXEMPTED the police unions from his collective bargaining ban?
    Look at the history of votes on drugs or civil liberties. Who brought us the War on Drugs? The Patriot Act? Guantanamo? Torture? LAW AND ORDER REPUBLICANS my friend. And even though you like calling anybody you want liberals, they don’t call themselves that and nobody else does either.
    I’m not defending Obama or any centrists from any party, obviously. But blaming all the evils of the world on liberals is so historically inaccurate it makes you look like a Jonestown cult member.
    Again, you don’t get it just define how you’d like the terms liberal and conservative to be used. The OC Register is a conservative paper. Liberalism in the US is largely dead anyway. Clinton and Obama killed it.

    What are you talking about, JT? It’s not only the libertarian party that supports illegal immigration. It is primarily the democrats and the liberals who make up most of the democrat party. The libertarians and the liberals/socialists/democrats hold hands in their crusade for illegal immigration.

    So you have to go back to Pete Wilson and the unions? Please, stop being disingenuous, JT. You know, I know and the world knows that union support is primarily (90%) liberals, democrats and socialists. Conservative – in the large large majority – hate public unions. For you to say otherwise, again, detracts from your credibility.

    Obama, a liberal, extended the Patriot Act indefintely. Obama, a liberal, waged war against Libya without consulting congress first in violation of the War Powers Act of 1973. Obama, a liberal, signed the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) which effectively eroded due process for American citizens. Obama, a liberal, FAILED to close Guantanamo, as he promised in 2008. Obama, a liberal, recently though his executive power has authorized the Secret Service to arrest people who are protesting his policies if they are within a certain distance of his events IF the Secret Service finds those individuals to he ‘suspicious’ whatever that means. Obama, a liberal, has contined to allow government agencies to eavesdrop on American citizens without securing a warrant from the high courts and to hold ISP’s and telephone companies harmless if they participate in eavesdropping or turning over account information on American citizens to authorities. Obama is a LIBERAL, JT. A dyed in the wool LIBERAL. So please stop playing the word games.

    1. No disrespect, but its like talking to a deaf parrot. Yeah, I know all that about Obama, that’s why I don’t support him. I already said that. He’s continued Bush’s authoritarianism. Bush was a conservative supposedly. Or are you going to tell me he was a liberal. Nothing would surprise me at this point.

      There’s nothing worse than a hypocrite. There’s plenty of blame to go around for a lot of stuff. Democrats corruption is as bad as Republicans. Republicans have been the law and order party since Nixon though. They presided over the enormous enlargement of the military and of domestic law enforcement. The God Almighty Ronald Reagan brought us deficits, huge military increases, harsh new drug laws, and prisons. Republicans are pretty big on war in case you haven’t noticed. Orange County Republicans supported all of that shit. Look in the fucking mirror. Now some of you don’t, well good for you. Evolution is always welcome. But don’t get all high and mighty about it.

                1. Phony left right paradigm-both arms connected to the same monster and the result is the destruction of our Republic,our sovereignty and our standard of living.

  20. Durr! :

    Left and right exist

    You suddenly remind me of this guy.

    People identify themselves that way – its not me that’s so into doing that

    The problem is not with people who identify themselves as left or right, the problem is people who live their lives in a left vs. right bubble and are incapable of functioning unless reality fits within that tight little bubble.
    Sadly most of these people are easily manipulated and incapable of having true human feelings/emotions unless their party leaders tell them too. If that isnt cultish I don’t know what is.

    You’re so fucking obtuse you can’t even figure out we’re on the same side.

    There you go again with “sides”. You seriously have a problem.

    Once again, we agree on the basic point about the left/right bubble. Do you understand that now? I’ve said it like 3 times already. That’s what I mean by “sides.” We’re on the same side of THE ARGUMENT.

    The thing is, since most people live their lives in that bubble you have to be able to talk to them about it and you have to know the history of what each side thinks and does.

    its not rocket science.

  21. Here’s another:

    Changing the world one city at a time

    by Steven Greenhut 05/14/2012

    “SACRAMENTO — Given the nation’s deep fiscal problems, many Americans of the Right and Left are so frustrated about the political process that they are jumping on Tea Party buses and occupying city parks. But efforts to reform Washington, D.C., or Sacramento are hopeless, despite those “change” slogans advanced by a president committed mainly to the status quo. If you want to change the world, you need to start in your city.

    A great example of what agitated citizens can accomplish is taking place in the Southern California city of Fullerton.”

    http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=51479

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