McKinley Hired Jay Cicinelli.

Smile now, cry later...

Former Fullerton Police  Chief, and now city council recall target Pat McKinley hired Jay Cicinelli. Cicinelli was arraigned yesterday in Suprior Court in the homicide death of Kelly Thomas at the hands of six McKinley proteges.

But among all the pickpockets, thieves, sexual predators, kidnappers, thugs, and murderers hired by McKinley, Jay Cicinelli was special. The recipient of several gunshot wounds including the head shot that cost him an eye and probably useful brain matter, Cicinelli was placed on a permanent disability pension by LAPD who wisely concluded that Cicinelli was no longer fit to be a policeman.

Enter Mike Hillman, an LAPD honcho and old pal of then Fullerton Chief McKinley; Hillman was determined that Cicinelli fulfill his life’s calling as a cop, and public safety be damned. In McKinley, Hillman found his man, and Cicinelli was put to work with a badge and a gun on the streets of Fullerton. Need some corrobrating testamony? Here’s the money quote from article linked above from none other than Jay Cicinelli:

I think he had a lot to do with getting me this job, I know he was good friends with (Fullerton Police) Chief Pat McKinley. How many departments are going to hire an officer with one eye?

Let’s put this in perspective: doing a favor for an old LAPD crony, McKinley placed the citizens of Fullerton at pysical and financial risk by employing and deploying a cop rejected by LAPD. It was done knowingly, cavalierly, and utterly irresponsibly. Apart from recognizing the alarming potential for post traumatic stress disorder, even the average civilian will have wondered at the obvious depth-perception and peripheral vision issues connected to a one-eyed cop.

Still waiting for his "Authorities" to tell him what to do...

And now that it’s time to take accountability for his actions, his out-of-town handlers won’t let McKinley do at least one honorable thing in his life: resign.

So we’re going to help him.

Behind Closed Doors Dead heads Dick Jones Don Bankhead Patdown Pat McPension Repuglicanism Setting The Bar Low

208 thoughts on “McKinley Hired Jay Cicinelli.

  1. So when this one eye murder was at the dmv and they said cover your right eye and read, what did he say? No. Yes this was a favor. So McYoda has to go, on lack of judgement alone. See ya, wouldnt wanna be ya!

    1. We all know the the DA was FORCED to bring charges because the cover-up blew up. The community wouldn’t rest, word got out about the existence of the tape and a ton of people saw what happened. The genie got out of the bottle with a bullhorn. What we must do now is recall and replace the council and start firing the criminal co-conspirators. There are plenty still in the building. If we can’t throw’em in jail then we can throw’em out on their asses. They obviously hate what happened. It is their worst nightmare- the light of day followed by charges, the feds sniffin’ around and a huge media circus. WE ALL KNOW THAT THERE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE CHARGED. Fullerton’s finances will be in ruin and the city now needs austerity measures like yesterday. Hear that gang? The gig is up.

  2. Elect a barely retired, $200,000 pensioned police chief to your city council? Is it still the 1950’s cold war? Is this post war Iraq ? Is it drug smuggling Mexico ? No just dumb ass ignorant repuglican Fullerton.

    1. McKinley at his installation thanked his Campaign Manager, Lois Godfrey, pro Redevelopment GOP er. Is she going to retain her position??? Does she have no shame?

  3. I think two posters covered this pretty well.

    http://www.fullertonsfuture.org/2011/who-is-jay-cincinelli/#comment-35437

    I am going to preface this statement by saying the following: I like everyone else, am not a perfect human being. I make mistakes- but I am quick to admit those mistakes, hopefully learn from them and continue life with some added humility and experience. Having said that, I live my life within a logical set of parameters such as: 2+2=4, if I jump out of a 15th floor window there is a law called gravity that will 99.999% of the time cause me to hit the ground at terminal velocity and die; also, the Sun will rise in the East and set in the West, I should avoid taking plugged in electrical appliances into the bathtub with me etc,etc etc. Rules to live by if you will. Absurd comments you might say but you will see where I am going with this shortly.

    Some other facts that are pertinent here.
    A normal person has a little less than 180 degrees field of vision if you factor in peripheral vision. You would therefore by subtraction deduce that a person with one eye has about 90 degree field of vision- but it is even less than this because two eyes working together also provide depth perception that you lose with one eye.

    There is a reason why fighter pilots have two eyes and it is as obvious as 2+2. There is a reason why race horses have 4 legs and not 3. its as obvious as gravity. There is a reason why cops absolutely need two eyes that is as obvious as any physical law and absolutely critical to the safety and welfare of others.
    I can already hear you saying-”It’s not eyesight that caused the death here” you are right. It is faulty decision making. If common sense, 2+2, logic and reason, pluses and minuses were followed, officer X would have remained medically retired and Kelly would probably still be alive. Allow me to further elaborate.

    When I worked, police agencies scrutinized you with a fine tooth comb prior to hiring you-physically, mentally, financially, relationships,emotionally etc etc etc. Relatively minor physical defects or injuries and you were not getting hired. I had a friend who was a former Navy Seal-we were trying like hell to get him hired- physically of course top of the line-all the attributes you want- I knew he would transition right in. The psychologist said no-that he was overtrained and would be too quick to pull the trigger and he was out-just like that. I knew the guy and I knew that was not the case- but my personal feelings were trumped by the process. And folks it is that way for a reason.

    When you take Police Department hiring policies and standards and turn them into a “Make A Wish Foundation” charity so that some cop at another agency whose career was unfortunately cut short so that he can continue to “live his dream” of being a cop and make your department a dumping ground for other agencies rejects you have set yourself on a collision course with tragedy.

    Ironically, Fullerton dodged the bullet for 15 or so years. I say ironically because I can think of countless ways this COULD have gone sideways-not only for Fullerton P.D. but for an unsuspecting neighboring agency when this handicapped cop was sent in on mutual aid. Football is a game of inches- Police work is a game of milliseconds that involves SEEING a threat, reacting properly to the threat and neutralizing the threat. If you miss step one and don’t see the threat, steps 2 and 3 don’t apply and people die. Of course if it’s just you-the handicapped one who is living out his dream of being a cop that dies- you died doing what you loved etc, etc. But it seems like it never plays out that way- it plays out something like this: A bar disturbance where our one eyed officer and officer Smith suddenly find themselves surrounded by a large crowd who all have various issues with the Police. The two officers circle the wagons in the classic back to back to provide a almost 360 degree field of vision-oops its really only a 270 degree because the cop who is living his dream is missing that critical 90 degrees. You guessed it- the 9 millimeter pops up in that missing 90 degrees, the shot is fired,officer Smith’s brains are blown out-he leaves behind a wife, three kids and a mother with Alzheimer’s disease. Officer Make A wish HEARS the shot ,returns fire,kills the suspect and just to complete the Disney Movie script that he is living out-He receives the medal of Valor. By the way, officer smith could have been me in a mutual aid scenario-I would have never known my follow up only had one eye.My wife would have become the proud owner of the City of Fullerton.

    Or how about this scenario- Officer Make a Wish is responding to an assistance call in a residential neighborhood. He’s driving a little faster than the posted 25 MPH. Little Billy Johnson suddenly comes into that missing 90 degree field of vision on his bicycle and the inevitable happens- his parents would basically now own the City of Fullerton for their negligent hiring and retention practices after they buried their son. The liability assumed in the hiring of this individual for his vision handicap alone was astronomical- but then again McKinley wasn’t gambling with his money- he was gambling with ours-the taxpayers money. His cronyism for his old LAPD pals and his ego was more important than the citizens of Fullerton.
    Whether or not the officer in question (name already revealed on KTTV news so don’t threaten me with lible) suffered other mental or emotional damage as a result of his incident is unknown but may prove to be a valuable defense strategy if it gets to that level. That will leave the City of Fullerton holding the bag for what will be a staggering wrongful death payout. Don’t you feel good about your “compassion” now ex-Chief McKinley. You chose to play the fairy godmother and grant this dude his wish-are you losing sleep about this like me and other citizens? It seems like nobody is more horrified about this than soldiers who have done combat duty in Iraq or Afghanistan. My son is a US Army Sergeant/Ranger- grew up here. Wounded in Afghanistan. Called me from his duty post and told me he is embarassed to answer questions from the other soldiers about this travesty. This is not in the Warriors vernacular- they THE TRUE HEROES- defend the defenseless like Kelly. “The bottom line here is if common sense, logic and sound hiring practices were used (90+90=180;;90+0=90) this individual never gets hired and tragedy may have been avoided.
    My heart goes out to the rank and file at FPD who are ethical honest and deplore this travesty. If you were involved in the hiring process of this individual I hope you noted your concerns because I am sure you were over-ridden by the Chiefs office.

    Then to sit in the City Council meeting and see McKinley sitting there like an uninvolved observer while Sellers gets crucified made me sick. The question is- how many other LA rejects were hired here as favors to old friends?
    I’d be surprised if a Grand Jury isn’t looking at this as we speak. This is international- my relatives in Germany called me about it. The tidal wave that is going to hit FPD is staggering. This is going to be an open wound for a long time- a scar forever.

    And save your replies about withholding judgment until all the facts are in-there are enough facts right now (a death at the hands of others, video, spontaneous statements on video by witnesses, an ominous silence by FPD) in front of the public to make a probable cause arrest- like Ron Thomas said a citizen’s ass would be in a dark cell right now. Had to dump it all here after a mostly sleepless night of playing this in my head, sorry if I went long with it and is my humble opinion offered as a father and retired cop who is revolted by this.

    1. http://www.fullertonsfuture.org/2011/who-was-there-the-fpd-six/#comment-35318

      It kind of explains why they were so quick to reach a paltry settlement with Mr. Thomas. This goes beyond a beating, its very possible that they knowingly gave a mentally handicap man a badge and gun then let him out on the streets.

      If its true that he continued to beat Kelly Thomas after he was unconscious and didn’t stop even after blood was flying out of his head demonstrates a lack of impulse control in my opinion.

      Even the police union is keeping quiet. This doesnt look good for the fullerton police dept.

      …Just look at the photo of Jay Cincinelli below …look at him. Im sorry but he does not look like anyone who is fit enough to be allowed anywhere near a weapon, let alone make critical life or death decisions.

      This wasnt just an eye injury. Look at his stance and posture, the shooting obviously caused brain damage in my opinion.

      I wonder why they went through so much trouble to hire him, it wasnt like he was a senior officer with specialized skills. He was a rookie LAPD officer with only three weeks experience.

      Michael Hillmann and Patrick McKinley screwed up big time by letting him on the force. Current chief Michael Sellers screwed up by not only letting him continue to be active after the shooting but reassigned him to work undercover detail after the public uproar and as the article pointed out, the union screwed up by turning a blind eye to someone who obviously isn’t physically and maybe even mentally fit to be an officer.

      I want to know how many complaints were received about him (from other officers or the public), if he was allowed to drive a patrol car, if he needed any assistance performing his duties and if he was involved in any shootings or traffic accidents.

      I think what happened here was a “perfect storm”… You had a young man who badly wanted to be a police officer but that dream was snuffed out when he got shot in the head and lost an eye. I think that shooting left him with brain damage so instead of giving up and taking retirement he was still focused on becoming a cop because the part of his brain that controls impulse and reasoning was damaged.

      On the other hand you had higher ups at the LAPD who felt so sorry for him ignored the signs of brain damage and took his constant insistence to become a cop again as dedication and strong will instead of brain damage. They also ignored the fact that he lacked depth perception so it would be impossible for him to shoot without putting the public and other officers in danger.

      Fortunately former LAPD Chief Parks read between the lines and made the right decision to remove him. Unfortunately two of the higher ups at LAPD (Hillman & McKinley) were still intent of getting him in law enforcement again and part of this was probably due to Officer Cincinelli’s constant no-stop insistence.

      Eventually they decided to put him on the Fullerton PD, probably fudged the psychological evaluation (if they even had one) and definitely ignored the P.O.S.T requirements.

      In the meanwhile you had a police dept whose policy was to use heavy handed tactics and extreme force and now you had a brain damaged cop with lack impulse control on the force working in these conditions…

      Fast forward to June 5 2011, all of this came together and what you had was a brain damaged cop lacking impulse beat a man to death. The reason why the beating was so severe and obvious is because that part of his brain that used reason, logic and impulse is either gone or screwed up.

      The reason why the other cops didn’t step in and stop it is because Officer Cicinelli was a high ranking police officer (a Lt I believe) and they were going off the old “Blue Code of Silence” mentality.

      Pat McKinley should be removed from Office and thrown in Jail. He is the one behind the heavy handed policy and he is the one who allowed a partially blind mentally retarded man on his police force.

      The other officers who stood by and did nothing while Officer Cicinelli brutally and viciously bludgeoned a man to death should be thrown in jail.

      1. Brain damage and lack of impulse control may explain Mr.One-Eyed cop’s behaviour, but what about the other guy ? Ramos?
        It would be interesting to know if he had been involved in previous incidents of alleged misconduct, my guess is yes.
        Another violent thug, drunk with power and thoroughly entrenched in the Homeland Security sponsored ‘Martial Law’ mindset.

        1. Ramos started the chain of events and was rightfully charged but Officer Retardo Cyclops literally beat in the face of Kelly Thomas and kneed his throat. I find it interesting that the DA ignored the bulk of Retardo Cyclops’ involvement in this.

    2. “McKinley wasn’t gambling with his money- he was gambling with ours-the taxpayers money. ”

      Absolutely. That little deal with the devil is now done. And the devil wants to redeem his chips.

    3. Well said and well written. Councilman Mc Kinley reminded me recently at a city council meeting, that he “was” the cities, public safety officer when he “was” the chief. He, Jones, and Bankhead, have FAILED to protect the citizens of Fullerton by allowing the poiice department to run wild. They need to step down or face recall. Please save the city another $100,000.00 and step down. This 100k is a drop in the buckett to what this wrongful death lawsuit and others will cause Fullerton because of their ignorance and apathy.

  4. Isn’t this the modus operendi of all of Fullerton PD and the city council’s “good ol boy” network. They are so busy doing favors for their friends they they neglect what is best for the city they are paid to protect and serve. End result “corruption”. This was evident in the cover-up by Goodrich, Sellers and other FPD officers. This was evident in letting the officers watch their video and audio footage prior to “fabricating” their police reports. THIS MAKES ME SICK. What part did Goodrich, Sellers and Hughs not understand when Ramos said: ” See these fists, These are the fists that are about to Fuck You Up!” And they covered it up.

    1. I agree. I’m more sickened by the FPD lies and cover-up than the actual beating and murder.
      I want charges against Any and All senior FPD officials that knew the truth and helped cover it up. That is the true justice, because the senior FPD officials ENABLED THIS BEHAVIOR.
      If your cop on the street and know you can beat the shit out of people without recourse from your bosses and they will even help you cover it up, the Chief and Captains might as well be charged with murder as well. They enabled this behavior!!

  5. Like I said in the past, the fed’s need to come in and investigate the entire department from top to bottom! What else has taken place in the past that we don’t know about?

  6. Also, because the official cause of death was compression of the thorax, which prevented Kelly from breathing, why are the cops responsible for that not being charged???

  7. Its this blasted Kronism, I hate it. See it all the time, even in private sector, but really disgusting in the public sector….anything we can do about it?

  8. I notice the Tumescent Trio (love that btw) are now trying to congratulate themselves for their stoic heroism throughout this affair, ignoring and hoping we ignore the Culture of Corruption.

    Jones, Bankhead, McPension: the other 4 are not charged (yet) violated FPD policy by aiding and abetting the perpetration of several felonies. The watch commander and supervisors who tried to cover up this mess have yet to be identified.

    The feds will be knocking at your door soon on civil rights violation charges.

    Garo Mardirossian will be paying you several visits with regard to Kelly Thomas and the perjuring goon for hire, Kenton Hampton

    Let’s not forget the sexual battery and kidnapping cases, the suicide in the jail, the laptop theft, the credit card fraud, the false arrest of that kid.

    Real men would stand up and take responsibility for the mess they have made of the FPD.

    Oh no, boys’ we’re not done with you assholes by a long shot.

    Aw, Hell I might as well just write a post.

  9. As the DA said, ” even citizens have a right to defend themselves” against L.E.
    The lines should be long requesting Concealed weapons Permits.

    Unless the whole Gang culture of FPD is disbanded, McKinley, Bankhead and Jones tossed out of Office.
    This City will NEVER recover or deserve to.

    1. The funny thing is its impossible to get a CCW permit thanks to Sheriff Sandra Hutchens but you can open carry as long as the weapon is unloaded

  10. I personally do not have a problem with a person having only one eye being hired as a police officer.

    That said, this entire police force is corrupt, is run by union thugs, and it needed to be shut down and all pensions revoked.

    1. I personally do not have a problem with a person having only one eye being hired as a police officer.

      Neither did McKinley and look what happened.

      As the other posters pointed out

      A bar disturbance where our one eyed officer and officer Smith suddenly find themselves surrounded by a large crowd who all have various issues with the Police. The two officers circle the wagons in the classic back to back to provide a almost 360 degree field of vision-oops its really only a 270 degree because the cop who is living his dream is missing that critical 90 degrees. You guessed it- the 9 millimeter pops up in that missing 90 degrees, the shot is fired,officer Smith’s brains are blown out-he leaves behind a wife, three kids and a mother with Alzheimer’s disease. Officer Make A wish HEARS the shot ,returns fire,kills the suspect and just to complete the Disney Movie script that he is living out-He receives the medal of Valor.

      and

      it wasnt like he was a senior officer with specialized skills. He was a rookie LAPD officer with only three weeks experience.

      You may not have a problem with it but I do. I certainly wouldn’t want to be in a hostage situation with a one eye cop standing in front of me and I sure as hell don’t want to be in the backdrop if he ever got into a shootout.

      Its not like there is a shortage of full able citizens waiting in line to become police officers.

  11. Also, let’s not forget about the bar, with the police officers hang out and allegedly the source of the initial complaint.

    If this bar, or the owner of the bar, filed a complaint against Kelly Thomas, a false complaint, then it needs to be shut down or burned down. If I lived there I would help protest in front of the bar every day until it shut down.

  12. Ramos’ attorney, John D. Barnett, called Rackauckas’ charges “unprecedented.”

    “I’ve seen the video and Officer Ramos is not guilty of murder, manslaughter or any other crime,” Barnett told City News Service. “He was a peace officer in the lawful performance of his duty.”

    Barnett said Ramos was trying to “de-escalate” the situation when he allegedly shook his fists at Thomas.

    “All Kelly Thomas had to do was comply and it would have been a normal arrest, but he didn’t comply,” Barnett said.

    http://www.myfoxla.com/dpp/news/local/cop-charged-in-beating-death-in-jail-20110922

    1. Didn’t you get the memo from Chris Thompson? Now that the ‘do-nothing DA’ did everything they said he wasn’t going to do, it’s time to turn our attention away from justice for Kelly Thomas and toward the really important matter of FFF’s power play in Fullerton.

      Meanwhile, what really has become a lynch-mob mentality here includes a frequent poster who strongly advised the mob to bring firearms to the Kelly Thomas Memorial Concert, and who has said he wants to beat a couple of us he disagrees with to “within and inch” of our lives, and now we have this guy advocating that the Slidebar be burned down.

      Maybe Chris was right after all, perhaps it is time to turn our attention elsewhere. This place is getting really ugly.

      1. If it wasnt for the public’s pressure, the ‘do-nothing DA’ would have done exactly that.

        Of course to quell the public’s anger, the ‘do-nothing DA’ submitted an extremely weak case full of holes that the defense will rip apart and knowing full well that a jury won’t convict.

        Jerry Brown did the same thing with the Bell corruption case.

        1. “If it wasnt for the public’s pressure, the ‘do-nothing DA’ would have done exactly that.”

          And you know this how? Because that’s what everybody here would now like to believe? Now I’m not going to say that the pressure didn’t contribute to the outcome, hell, that’s why I came to FFF in the first place, to help in some small way with that effort, but despite what you’ve been told, this is not the first time the OC DA has prosecuted cops for serious misbehavior. In fact he has been involved in a feud with local cops and their unions state-wide for calling them out with regard to the ‘blue wall of silence’ in the Hibbs excessive force case, and then for refusing to back down when they bitched about it.

          As for the case against the cops, you know nothing of which you speak. Here’s a little about it I wrote elsewhere this morning:

          What we have here is text book example of the application of California’s strict Felony Murder Rule. If you are not familiar with the rule, part of it came about as a result of case law established in People v. Ford, where the CA Supreme Court ruled that “homicide during the commission of felony” can be prosecuted as second degree murder. This is precisely why T-Rack charged Ramos with Felony Involuntary Manslaughter; it was this act, taking place as it did during a homicide that opened the door to second degree murder charges.

          (Reality Is questioned yesterday the reasoning behind charging the same individual with both murder and manslaughter, above is the answer)

          It’s also worth noting that the coroner listed ‘homicide’ as the cause of death, underscoring something I’ve been posting about here and getting beat up over for weeks: The importance of waiting for the autopsy report before charging Kelly Thomas’ killers with the most serious charges available.

          Without the coroner’s ruling of homicide the Felony Murder Rule would not apply to Ramos, and the wailing and gnashing of teeth here over far lesser charges having been filed would have been deafening.

          It’s bad enough as it is, despite the fact that yesterday T-Rack presented a passionate and very solid case for MURDER against the police officer responsible for Thomas’ horrible death, Ramos having been the one who “escalated the lawful detainment (of Thomas) to an unlawful use of force.”

          1. And you know this how?

            Because it took them months to charge the officers involved despite having, audio evidence, video evidence and over 100 witnesses.

            And lets not forget that the whole time they claimed that they were waiting for the corners report to complete their investigation which interesting enough took them less than 24 hours to “complete” after “officially” receiving the report.

            It seems to me they were dragging their feet and hoping that the outrage would die down over time but when that didn’t happen, they decided to submit a weak BS case full of holes which the defense will tear apart.

            They did that because they want their hands clean, they want to say “hey we charged them, don’t blame us, blame the jury for not convicting them”.

          2. My almost doppelganger wrote: “Because it took them months to charge the officers involved despite having, audio evidence, video evidence and over 100 witnesses. And lets not forget that the whole time they claimed that they were waiting for the corners report…”

            Did you read my post above?

            We now know why waiting for the coroner’s report was so absolutely important. Under the Felony Murder Rule, Ramos could be charged with Second Degree Murder if a homocide occured during his commision of a felony. The coroner’s report finally came out and in it the cause of death was not just listed as ‘assault’ as it was on the UCI doctor’s death certificate, it was listed as HOMICIDE. Now, along with Felony Involuntary Manslaugher, under California’s strict Felony Murder Rule, officer Ramos could be charged with Second Degree Murder.

            Without the coroner’s ruling of homocide the murder rule would not have applied and Ramos would have had to of been charged with a lesser crime. Everyone here praying for justice in the MURDER of Kelly Thomas got their wish yesterday, and it would not have happened without a very favorable to the prosecution autopsy report. I’m amazed how many here don’t seem to get this.

          1. Okay, thanks, and do you now understand why the DA was absolutely correct in waiting for the coroner’s report with its finding of the cause of death as HOMICIDE as opposed to the death certificate which listed simple ‘assault?’

            No homicide = no Felony Second Degree Murder. That’s as simple as it can be explained.

          2. Okay, thanks, and do you now understand why…

            I fully understand the concept and if FPD, The DA and the Coroner were playing fair and by the rules that is what would have happened but they’re not.

            As I said before, it seems to me they were dragging their feet and hoping that the outrage would die down over time but when that didn’t happen, they decided to submit a weak BS case full of holes which the defense will tear apart.

      2. I posted this on another thread but it seems more applicable here:

        I think you’re missing the bigger picture here.

        The Kelly Thomas murder (we can legally call it that now, right?) was just the most horrendous manifestation of Fullerton’s longstanding problem with police brutality and police misconduct.

        The three city council members Jones, Bankhead and McKinley are key in the creation of this goon squad and its mentality. They either encouraged this or looked the other way. I’m thinking encouraged. Even if they hadn’t, they would still be culpable just because of their authority in hiring the Chief of Police.

        The citizens of Fullerton sleep only marginally safer in our beds tonight. The sad reality is that police abuse by the FPD is not limited to just one, or two, or even six officers. That is the open secret that is soon not even going to be a secret.

        However, as each new brutality victim emerges and files suit, there is no administrative body beyond Internal Affairs (a joke in FPD if there ever was one) and the City Council to DO SOMETHING about all of these other cases.

        That is why we need a city council who will take dramatic and drastic actions to rid the City of corruption and police brutality. That might even be to abolish the FPD – and while I don’t know what the consequences of that would be – I LOVE the message it sends:

        Mess with your citizens too much and we will fire each and every one of you.

        That is why Chris is right and this is not a micro-local issue. Every other town out there needs to be doing the same thing. Then it is as macro an issue as you can get.

      3. Yes let’s talk about FFFFs “power play.” The three cretins permitted an environment of corruption to fester and bloom in the FPD. It’s all there: a string of disgusting and arrogant behavior that was perpetrated with a sense of entitlement and impunity.

        If that’s of no interest to you then yes, it’s time for you to turn your attention elsewhere.

      4. When posters were discussing the nightstick wielded by Ramos, weren’t you the one who said some posters here could use a wood shampoo? Take your violent inflammatory language somewhere else EYEKNOWEVERYTHING.

        1. I said some of the ‘idiots,’ and I also explained clearly that it was a “dumb joke.” My exact words.

          On the other hand, I don’t think advocating that the Slidebar be burned down was meant as a joke.

          Nor was the guy joking that said folks should take firearms with them to the concert, and I’m pretty sure he really meant it when he said he’d like to beat a couple of us to within an inch of our lives. He’s been defending both statements right along.

          1. “Wood shampoo’ is a very old joke that first made the rounds in so cal in the 80s. I did not threaten anyone or any business specifically. To now conveniently attempt to call it “violent inflammatory language” is not just a stretch, it’s absolutely silly.

            That being said, someone asked me to explain and I do indeed remember writing back “instead of explaining my dumb joke, why don’t you tell me…” and went on with the discussion. I don’t see it there now, so maybe it was on another thread, or there was a glitch in the system. It’s happened before. But in any case, “violent inflammatory language???” come on. Lame. Do better.

          2. Maybe it was on another thread? Here are your exact words:

            “I said some of the ‘idiots,’ and I also explained clearly that it was a “dumb joke.” My exact words.”

            Yes, it is silly. There is no “lynch mob” here despite your best efforts to incite one.

          3. What was actually said:

            “If this bar, or the owner of the bar, filed a complaint against Kelly Thomas, a false complaint, then it needs to be shut down or burned down. If I lived there I would help protest in front of the bar every day until it shut down.”

            I did not use the term “Slidebar”.

            You conveniently failed to mention several conditional signals such as “if”, “false complaint”.

            Nor did I advocate the illegal burning of the bar. The bar should be shut down and then burned, legally. Sometimes humans perform evil deeds of such magnitude that the establishments associated with such deeds need to be legally destroyed. It seems to me this bar qualifies.

            Finally, I said I would help protest to have the bar shut down, not burned down.

            I must commit your commitment to honesty and integrity is less than inspiring.

        1. Oh yeah, my problem with group-thinkers extends all the way into government. For example, I’ve been opposed to the death penalty for more than 40 years, ever since Viet Nam and Kent state… any government that would do what was done in those times should not be trusted with such ultimate power of life and death over its citizens.

          As for my work, I am a the owner of small business (publishing), living in South OC for nearly 20 years.

          I found this site after posting in several places about the Thomas murder. And I have a documented history of advocating for justice in the Kelly Thomas murder well before ever showing up on FFF. Here’s a post of mine on the Voice Of OC from more than six weeks ago, illustrating my state of mind at the time very well:

          “This is rapidly turning into the most shameful event in modern OC history. “–EyeNeverSayNo posted at 8:36 am on Sat, Aug 6, 2011

          http://voiceofoc.org/oc_north/fullerton/article_4ca218cc-bfbc-11e0-a4e2-001cc4c03286.html

          Everybody loved me here when my posts conformed to the widely accepted group-think. It was only after I decided a few weeks ago that the DA would in fact bring serious charges, and as he said, very soon, that my position made me the enemy. I was asked repeatedly “who’s side are you on?”

          This opinion of mine turned out to be entirely correct, I even called when the announcemnet would be made, but it definitely did not conform to the ‘do-nothing corrupt DA’ gospel preached here and widely accepted as fact. So of course I had to become either Susan Kang Schroeder, a law enforcement plant, one of the six or a family member, and now a statist.

          (sigh)

          1. Susan Kang, give it a rest. Your “do-nothing” boss did exactly that.

            He filed a watered down case that he knows damn well wont lead to a conviction.

          2. I still love you Eye 🙂

            And agreed on the death penalty. If cops and prosecutors were honest, than perhaps one could make an argument for it. Given the sad reality, its a terrible idea.

      5. Okay, thanks, and do you now understand why…

        I fully understand the concept and if FPD, The DA and the Coroner were playing fair and by the rules that is what would have happened but they’re not.

        As I said before, it seems to me they were dragging their feet and hoping that the outrage would die down over time but when that didn’t happen, they decided to submit a weak BS case full of holes which the defense will tear apart.

    2. Officers shall not have the right, in America, to be judge and jury out on the street, ever!

      Amazing hoe these goons forget where they live.

      Idiots!

    3. THEY FILED CHARGES AGAINST THE LAPD COPPERS WHO BEAT RODNEY DIDN’T THEY. SO, HOW ARE THESE CHARGES UNPRECEDENTED? JUST WAIT TIL CHARGES ARE FILED AGAINST THE OTHER FOUR ASSHOLES!

  13. T N Z :http://www.fullertonsfuture.org/2011/who-was-there-the-fpd-six/#comment-35318

    It kind of explains why they were so quick to reach a paltry settlement with Mr. Thomas. This goes beyond a beating, its very possible that they knowingly gave a mentally handicap man a badge and gun then let him out on the streets.
    If its true that he continued to beat Kelly Thomas after he was unconscious and didn’t stop even after blood was flying out of his head demonstrates a lack of impulse control in my opinion.
    Even the police union is keeping quiet. This doesnt look good for the fullerton police dept.
    …Just look at the photo of Jay Cincinelli below …look at him. Im sorry but he does not look like anyone who is fit enough to be allowed anywhere near a weapon, let alone make critical life or death decisions.
    This wasnt just an eye injury. Look at his stance and posture, the shooting obviously caused brain damage in my opinion.
    I wonder why they went through so much trouble to hire him, it wasnt like he was a senior officer with specialized skills. He was a rookie LAPD officer with only three weeks experience.
    Michael Hillmann and Patrick McKinley screwed up big time by letting him on the force. Current chief Michael Sellers screwed up by not only letting him continue to be active after the shooting but reassigned him to work undercover detail after the public uproar and as the article pointed out, the union screwed up by turning a blind eye to someone who obviously isn’t physically and maybe even mentally fit to be an officer.
    I want to know how many complaints were received about him (from other officers or the public), if he was allowed to drive a patrol car, if he needed any assistance performing his duties and if he was involved in any shootings or traffic accidents.
    I think what happened here was a “perfect storm”… You had a young man who badly wanted to be a police officer but that dream was snuffed out when he got shot in the head and lost an eye. I think that shooting left him with brain damage so instead of giving up and taking retirement he was still focused on becoming a cop because the part of his brain that controls impulse and reasoning was damaged.
    On the other hand you had higher ups at the LAPD who felt so sorry for him ignored the signs of brain damage and took his constant insistence to become a cop again as dedication and strong will instead of brain damage. They also ignored the fact that he lacked depth perception so it would be impossible for him to shoot without putting the public and other officers in danger.
    Fortunately former LAPD Chief Parks read between the lines and made the right decision to remove him. Unfortunately two of the higher ups at LAPD (Hillman & McKinley) were still intent of getting him in law enforcement again and part of this was probably due to Officer Cincinelli’s constant no-stop insistence.
    Eventually they decided to put him on the Fullerton PD, probably fudged the psychological evaluation (if they even had one) and definitely ignored the P.O.S.T requirements.
    In the meanwhile you had a police dept whose policy was to use heavy handed tactics and extreme force and now you had a brain damaged cop with lack impulse control on the force working in these conditions…
    Fast forward to June 5 2011, all of this came together and what you had was a brain damaged cop lacking impulse beat a man to death. The reason why the beating was so severe and obvious is because that part of his brain that used reason, logic and impulse is either gone or screwed up.
    The reason why the other cops didn’t step in and stop it is because Officer Cicinelli was a high ranking police officer (a Lt I believe) and they were going off the old “Blue Code of Silence” mentality.
    Pat McKinley should be removed from Office and thrown in Jail. He is the one behind the heavy handed policy and he is the one who allowed a partially blind mentally retarded man on his police force.
    The other officers who stood by and did nothing while Officer Cicinelli brutally and viciously bludgeoned a man to death should be thrown in jail.

    Never has there been a more perfect representation of “the road to hell is paved with good intentions.”

    Rookie cop eyes wide and apparently full of potential gets shot, six times, loses an eye, unqualified for LAPD as a result, forced into retirement, and down and out on his luck.

    Higher ups, specifically Hillmann and McKinley take pity on this pathetic fool and work out an arrangement to be hired on to the Fullerton police.

    Fast forward a decade and a half later, said prior decisions lead to a course of events and actions that ultimately contributed to the death of a man, quite literally, at the hands of the same fool they thought worthy of hiring despite obvious handicaps and impediments.

    And they wanted to try to suppress these “little details.”

    Your day of reckoning is upon you McKinley! For letting loose an animal such as Jay Cicinelli on to the streets, it’s time for you to pay! I would imagine, a recall from office should be the least of your worries at this point. Your name is mud, your reputation is sullied, and everyone will associate this incident with you for time immortal, you corrupt, arrogant, son of a bitch!!!

      1. and I’d like to think that Ron could also go after whoever performed a psych evaluation (if they had one) and approved him for duty.

      2. I was just trying to figure out how to word that but I see you did it very nicely:) The only thing I was thinking is that the atty’s are going to distance themselves from the FPD and vice versa and be pointing the finger at eachother therefore making some kind of connectioin difficult. That’s difficult to explain but it makes pefect sense to me:)

      1. I don’t know about you, but my mama would dis-own me for killing anyone, especially a harmless homeless guy.

        I wonder if sinsillys mama is proud of him now.

        What kind of woman raises this kind of guy?

    1. The phone call issue and slimebar is pretty moot. Ruckus said when they approached Kelly Ramos 350 knew Kelly and knew he wasn’t dangerous. Sidebar, Slimebar, Slidebar, whatever it’s called, is a side issue.

      I think it’s time for a hard hitting interview with McKinley. Of course the questioning should include his first priority of sympathy towards “the officers.” Why guys with less training than privates in the military are called “officers” is beyond me. Now they need to be called the defendants and the alleged murderers. No more officer lingo. Thats what the cops union lawyers want.

    2. I’m gonna spell this one out…OHHHHH MYYYY gOOOOODDDDD! You just opened that can of worms for EYE to freak out on again. Didn’t you listen to him before???????

  14. Awesome perspective in your posts above TNZ. Looks like this will be the most expensive lawsuit in history, in the civil suit and the second for Garo. I firmly believe there will be serious consequences coming down on Fullerton PD, as Captain Hamilton admitted he and other high ranking officers (I would think Chief Sellers as well) reviewed the city cam tape as well as the DAR recordings. Upon review of all above, one would think the FPD Boss would be as repulsed as DA Rackaucus was as he described what he saw to the press yesterday. This is a Perfect example of how EVIL and CORRUPT a law enforcement agency can be. FPD I believe are in BIG trouble in Federal kind of way.

    1. The thing with civil suits against police, is that they seem to have little deterrent effect. Guys with millions in judgments to their credit, stay on the force and get promoted. Nothing changes. No one faces any consequences.

      They just dip into the taxpayers’ pockets for more money and continue with their habit. I’m totally in favor of the civil suits. But it seems government employees and officials don’t give a shit. OPM.

      $10 million was paid out in the Tim Masters case in Colorado for a wrongful conviction. City officials there were very much like the three blind mice. Defending everything. A cop who is going to trial for felony perjury is of course still on paid administrative leave.

      Get rid of the state laws that pander to the unions. And get rid of the unions.

  15. 9c1 if he pleads mental disorder that will just underline the fact that he was unfit for service and never should have been hired.

  16. Get Real :
    Isn’t this the modus operendi of all of Fullerton PD and the city council’s “good ol boy” network. They are so busy doing favors for their friends they they neglect what is best for the city they are paid to protect and serve. End result “corruption”. This was evident in the cover-up by Goodrich, Sellers and other FPD officers. This was evident in letting the officers watch their video and audio footage prior to “fabricating” their police reports. THIS MAKES ME SICK. What part did Goodrich, Sellers and Hughs not understand when Ramos said: ” See these fists, These are the fists that are about to Fuck You Up!” And they covered it up.

    What amazes me is that ramos behaved liked that with full knowledge that he was being recorded. Can someone explain it to me. How many of these acts of violence are still on tape. I suppose all old tapes are destroyed. All parties involved saw the evidence and did nothing but cover it up. Criminal conspiracy on a large and wide scale. The Feds need to step in and remove the tyrants soon or you guys are done in Fullerton.

      1. Let’s mention obesity too, Being over weight limits the amount of blood flow to the brain thus rendering an individual with dim cognitive skills.

    1. I’m sure Ramos didnt’ care that he was being taped because he didn’t necessarily think, or even want,t o murder Ramos. He just wanted to put a hard-core vicious beating on him (which, obviously, is criminal). And he proceeded to do that, and called for back-up. But then Cyclops strolled up and went nuts with his taser and that, combined with all the cops on top of him, killed him. I’m not saying Ramos shouldn’t be charged with second degree murder–he absolutely should be. But it’s quite possible this dumb fat pig initiated a process that escaled beyond his remedial control. He’s a coward and a bully and he’s getting what he deserves. But Cyclops should also have gotten second-degree.

  17. Wrong Guy :
    Awesome perspective in your posts above TNZ. Looks like this will be the most expensive lawsuit in history, in the civil suit and the second for Garo. I firmly believe there will be serious consequences coming down on Fullerton PD, as Captain Hamilton admitted he and other high ranking officers (I would think Chief Sellers as well) reviewed the city cam tape as well as the DAR recordings. Upon review of all above, one would think the FPD Boss would be as repulsed as DA Rackaucus was as he described what he saw to the press yesterday. This is a Perfect example of how EVIL and CORRUPT a law enforcement agency can be. FPD I believe are in BIG trouble in Federal kind of way.

    What have they done that we don’t know about yet. Missing children, shakedowns, pedophillia the horror is terrifying. All audio tapes need to be examined.

  18. Simmons :
    I personally do not have a problem with a person having only one eye being hired as a police officer.
    That said, this entire police force is corrupt, is run by union thugs, and it needed to be shut down and all pensions revoked.

    That’s are start.

  19. Right. Based on how brazen FPD has been in recent past events, knowing that they are being video taped, there had to have been some murders, rapes and various crimes committed by these Thugs in dark alleys, etc. For reform, first off, they need to start ‘chopping off’ at the knees, by letting go of approx 30% of the field officers starting with the ones with most complaints (providing they haven’t thrown all those away). They and many other law enforcement agencies need to do this for there are TOO MANY cops on our streets, period. Why did it take 4 cop cars to pull some protester to cite him for horn honking? WASTE! Also, they need to have all cops in all ranks undergo a 730 Forensic Psychiatric Evaluation, annually. This would cost about $3K per officer per year, but letting go of 30% like stated above will more than offset this cost. Also random drug tests, specifically to check for steroid use and alcohol. This I believe would be abetter option than bringing in OCSD

    1. You hit it. There are way too many cops. Why? Because it’s unfortunately a bipartisan issue. Liberals like Obama want more union jobs, and conservatives of the authoritarian strain always think we can use more cops. They are not real capable of explaining why loser government union members suddenly become supermen once they don a badge and a costume. Most Americans aren’t looking that closely.

      This issue is nationwide and much bigger than “justice for Kelly. ” It is about justice for all of us.

  20. Kelly Thomas was killed by bullies, unfit to be employed in law enforcement. Ofcourse the thugs were just doing what they were told, to keep the “UNDESIRABLES” out of Fullerton. Ofcourse they drones went too far and Kelly died.

    NOW IS THE TIME TO CLOSE THE FULLERTON POLICE DEPARTMENT. CONTRACT OUT POLICE SERVICES WITH THE SHERIFF’S DEPARTMENT. TURN THE FORMER POLICE STATION INTO THE A HOMELESS SHELTER. NAME AND DEDICATE THE BUILDING “THE KELLY THOMAS BUILDING”. Kelly’s murder is NOT in vain. Good will come from this most horrible of deeds.

  21. Rufus, you are a stupid cop who’s been on the force too long to see right from wrong. Kelly’s father has nothing to do with this. Anal, ditto for you. Or are you one in the same, typical of cops these days? As for McKinley, he’s a POS who has made a rotten department worse with his corrupt shit he brought over from LAPD. He has hired sex offenders (or cops that have become one), thieves, drug addicts, incompetent cops in general and now murderers. He needs to go and so does that dept. It needs to be wiped off the OC map and all the crap that’s inside of it.

    1. I have met many good officers, too bad they have to share their careers with goons.

      They need to adopt a more democratic form of management.

      Limited termed management.

      1. They need to adopt a more customer service based management too.

        If someone has a complaint they shouldn’t be given dirty looks, yelled at, talked down to or harassed. Go to a cop and ask for a supervisor or for their badge number, you’ll probably be beaten and arrested on some false charge.

        If AT&T customer service conducted themselves the way most police departments do, they’d be bankrupt.

        A lot of commercial vehicles have a “hows my driving?” sticker to weed out bad employees, why don’t most police departments have something similar?

    1. I looked at the pictures of Ramos. Did anyone notice how flat the back of Ramos’s cranium is?

      That’s a sign of parental neglect when parents leave their baby in a crib for too long.

      The back of baby’s heads will form flat if the parents don’t pick up and hold the baby enough while the skull plates are forming and fusing.

      A round back crown of an adults head is evidence that a person was raised with great physical care.

      In order to get that round cranium form, the mother usually holds her baby throughout the bonding process and instinctually holds the baby’s head carefully at all times.

      1. i noticed in his mug shot that the right side of his head looks flattened in.

        he’s still fully responsible for his actions – which goes without saying.

        i think many of these cops are drawn to police work for the same reason many are drawn to gangs: they want a family and brothers and fathers they never had. they seek approval. they seek a cause. they seek systematic order. they seek strength in numbers. they seek herd mentality. the seek a certain degree of revenge on society. they seek a cover for their anger. they seek a reason to be tough every day.

  22. I think Cicinelli’s transfer to FPD had less to do with pity and much, much more to do with a favor between the two police departments and the circumstances of the shootout in which he lost an eye.

    1. Anon you are 100% correct on that one. It was a favor, McKinley brought over Blatney also. Along with James, Craig (I believe) and a dozen others years ago. This dept. is tainted through and through.

  23. #25 by Simmons on September 22, 2011

    I personally do not have a problem with a person having only one eye being hired as a police officer.

    Physical and mental tests for law enforcement are very extensive. Hearing must be within a certain range, flexability, regarding the lower back, must follow strict guidelines for acceptance, any previous injuries MUST be signed off by a county/city approved Doctor, including a lie detector, a full mental evaluation, both written and an oral interview with a Psychiatrist, etc. Those are just a few of the tests given.
    Now the eyes. A candidate Will be disqualified for: being color-blind, having little or no depth perception in BOTH eyes, poor vision in BOTH eyes, (unless correctible procedure/eye glasses brings vision within limits.
    Having good vision is mandatory to performing the tasks in law enforcement, in fact, it is Paramount in officer safety; the #1 thing that is stressed from the first day in the academy to one’s retirement day.
    Like TNZ stated in an earlier blog, without both eyes for depth perception/good range of vision, a person has no business being an officer. The dangers to himself/partner, let alone the citizenry, should a shooting incident occur, would not only spark a fury amongst the public if am unintended victim was accidentally shot, but would open a city/county to a quite substantial lawsuit.
    I am not trying to get on your case, but P.O.S.T., (Peace Officers Standards and Training), sets very strict guidelines for law enforcement.
    It is obvious that Cicinelli was NOT re-evaluated prior to being hired onto FPD. A few phone calls by some crony friends, and the dirty deed was done.

  24. Anonymous :
    Elect a barely retired, $200,000 pensioned police chief to your city council? Is it still the 1950′s cold war? Is this post war Iraq ? Is it drug smuggling Mexico ? No just dumb ass ignorant repuglican Fullerton.

    Yep.

  25. I just noticed in the DA’s press release a line that said:

    “After paramedics arrived, Cicinelli is accused of commenting about his use of force and the physical damage to Thomas.”

    I’m assuming this came from the paramedic witness statements, but were his exact words (or a paraphrase) reported anywhere? Was he “bragging” about what he had done to Kelly Thomas?? Maybe I missed this.

      1. I wonder if one of the six started getting that info out after they went back to the station.

        What if the other 4 were just waiting to leak this stuff out without retaliation?

  26. Anonymous :
    Ramos started the chain of events and was rightfully charged but Officer Retardo Cyclops literally beat in the face of Kelly Thomas and kneed his throat. I find it interesting that the DA ignored the bulk of Retardo Cyclops’ involvement in this.

    He has friends in high places and he’s calling in a lot of favors.

  27. We Are All One :

    Anonymous :
    Ramos started the chain of events and was rightfully charged but Officer Retardo Cyclops literally beat in the face of Kelly Thomas and kneed his throat. I find it interesting that the DA ignored the bulk of Retardo Cyclops’ involvement in this.

    He has friends in high places and he’s calling in a lot of favors.

    “He” as in Cicinelli.

  28. The Orange County Register :
    ‘Real’ officer wouldn’t beat Kelly Thomas, Fullerton ex-chief says
    http://www.ocregister.com/news/thomas-318392-ramos-officer.html

    THEY ALL VIEWED THE AUDIO AND VIDEO EVIDENCE AND THEY TRIED TO COVER IT UP. THE ENTIRE TRIBE NEEDS TO BE PROSECUTED AND HURT WHERE IT STINGS IN THEIR PURSES. WHY ISN’T THE D A PURSUING CHARGES AGAINST THE BOSSES WHO COVERED UP THE CRIMES. THEY WERE CAUGHT T-RACK DO SOMETHING DECENT AND GO AFTER THESE BASTARDS.

  29. We Are All One :

    We Are All One :

    Anonymous :
    Ramos started the chain of events and was rightfully charged but Officer Retardo Cyclops literally beat in the face of Kelly Thomas and kneed his throat. I find it interesting that the DA ignored the bulk of Retardo Cyclops’ involvement in this.

    He has friends in high places and he’s calling in a lot of favors.

    “He” as in Cicinelli.

    The D A is waiting for the furor to fade away and it will. The D A has favors to return.

    1. “Don’t worry Jay, I talked to the DA and he told me that he has no choice by to file charges in this case because of those knuckleheads out causing an uproar but he’s going to file an extremely weak case against you.” – Michael Hillman

      “We know of this lawyer Michael Schwartz who defended a deputy in San Bernardino. He’s going to pick this thing apart.” – Michael Hillman

      “Its a slam dunk. Those knuckleheads are gonna be pleased with the DA filing, the jury is gonna find you not guilty because the case is so weak and you’re gonna go home and have a good meal with your mom.” – Michael Hillman

  30. EyeLieToMyself :
    The 2nd informant on KFI said Cincinelli was bragging about it in the locker room and other officers were put off by it.

    They watched this kid be executed and did nothing they need to be prosecuted, but they won’t.

  31. #73 true he was the next few days in the locker room, before it went public. He deserves to be charged with Murder..He thought it was funny!

  32. Hi.
    Fuck all you slide bar haters out there. Slide bar rocks and I don’t think those cops did anything wrong.
    I hope Ramos and co. get 100% acquitted. You can’t hurt us or ever bring us down.

    1. Kelly Thomas If I could get another chance I’d put it in a zip-loc bag and keep it in my pocket, Keep it in my pocket, Keep it in my pocket

      1. Jeremy Popoff is a rockstar bitches! He can do whatever he wants in this town. He can fuck any girl he wants, has FPD in his pocket and can even have homeless guys killed for loitering.

    2. aww popoffzitonass, poor baby!!

      business down???? rofl

      Lit :
      Hi.
      Fuck all you slide bar haters out there. Slide bar rocks and I don’t think those cops did anything wrong.
      I hope Ramos and co. get 100% acquitted. You can’t hurt us or ever bring us down.

      1. I’ve boycotted Slidebar and don’t miss them one bit. I’m sure they don’t miss me, either, but whatever. They had a nice run, but those days are over.

  33. Not to offend anyone with a vision disability,but next time you’re driving in traffic…cover one eye for just 15 seconds and imagine you are a police officer.
    It is a scary thought that Pat Mckinley knowingly hired this guy despite being half blind.
    This officer should of never been assigned patrol duty.

    1. “…next time you’re driving in traffic…cover one eye for just 15 seconds and imagine you are a police officer.”

      That’s not a very accurate analogy, folks with one eye learn to adjust, the brain adapts, this is well recognized and the murdering thug Cincinelli is hardly the only one-eyed police officer in the country. I looked it up, each department sets its own standards and there are many that allow one-eyed cops. In fact, in one case I read about, a state court actually ordered a force to reinstate a one-eyed cop and ruled that according to expert testimony, he was fully fit to return to patrol duties.

      Not sayin’ Cicinelli should ever return to being a cop, but that’s because he’s an unstable asshole sadistic murderer, not because he’s one-eyed.

      1. “That’s not a very accurate analogy” because I (I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,i,) did all the research in the whole world, uh I mean universe, ummm and this one judge even……I (I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,) am the smartest person in this blog/room/city/world/universe AND I (I,I,I,I,I,I,) said so!!!!!! Dammit!!!! Why won’t you people listen to me (me,me,me,me,me,me,me)

  34. Is there anyone who believes that the cop who went behind the police vehicle to “check Kelly’s bag” didn’t know EXACTLY what was in store for Kelly?

    That one is just as guilty as that MF Ramos.

    1. Another thought, why did the police office go behind the car to check the backpack?

      Are the cameras no in the fron pointing forward?

      Seems like Wolfe would go to the front of the police car so the camera could capture what was being removed from the bag . . . unliess . . . Wolfe was goiog to put something in the bag . . ..
      who knows

  35. Captain Hamilton and all other captains, watch commander and the chief MUST be prosecuted for aiding and abbeding (check spelling) murderers.

      1. Yeah, there was another case involving cops falsifying police reports. Give me a min. and I’ll remember the name. It started w/an S. I can pix his face now but the name will come to me.

  36. “It kind of explains why they were so quick to reach a paltry settlement with Mr. Thomas.”

    This

    “The reason why the other cops didn’t step in and stop it is because Officer Cicinelli was a high ranking police officer (a Lt I believe) and they were going off the old “Blue Code of Silence” mentality.”

    This

    “The other officers who stood by and did nothing while Officer Cicinelli brutally and viciously bludgeoned a man to death should be thrown in jail.”

    And this.

    1. “The other officers who stood by and did nothing while Officer Cicinelli brutally and viciously bludgeoned a man to death should be thrown in jail.”

      What one thinks *should* be done, and what *can* be done according to the law and what can be proven in court are two very different things.

      Do I wish the other cops had intervened and stopped the beating? Of course. Do I believe that the officers have a Blue Code of Silence mentality? Absolutely. So does the DA, btw. Do I also understand, as a rational adult, why wishes are aren’t fishes? Yes.

      The OC DA wrote: “Based on the available evidence and all of the information reviewed related to this case, the evidence does not show that Officer Wolfe was aware of the physical threat made by Ramos against Thomas, which escalated the lawful detainment to an unlawful use of force. The evidence does not show that Officer Wolfe was aware upon joining the altercation that he was assisting in the restraint of a victim who had been subjected to excessive force by Ramos. Due to the lack of evidence to show knowing participation in an unlawful act, no charges can be filed against Officer Wolfe at this time.”

      This.

      1. BTW folks…this is all about EYE.. Why won’t you listen????? Also btw.. I (I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,) LOVE HAVING ALL THIS MATERIAL TO WORK WITH:):):):):):):)

  37. larry :
    Not to offend anyone with a vision disability,but next time you’re driving in traffic…cover one eye for just 15 seconds and imagine you are a police officer.
    It is a scary thought that Pat Mckinley knowingly hired this guy despite being half blind.
    This officer should of never been assigned patrol duty.

    No he shouldn’t. The psychological damage alone is enough to keep him off the force, let alone not being able to see. Close one eye and walk around for a while..

    1. “Close one eye and walk around for a while..”
      C’mom We didn’t you listen to EYE. That’s NOT a very good analogy! Listen to me!!!!!

  38. Corrupt :
    15 feet and he could not hear the conversation….. yeah right. Sounds like Wolfe needs a medical eval.

    Wolfe plays Deaf, Dumb and Blind. I can’t hear you.. la la la la

  39. I guess the trolls are out in full force today to make up for not having jack shit to say when the charges were announced.

      1. The charges were filed. Stop asking questions like “why did the DA file a weak case?” or “why did they lie about receiving the coroner’s report on the 20th?”. Its over. End of story. Move on with your lives.

  40. That Recall No website they put up might be the most Laughable attempt at a website I have ever witnessed. It just proves that your city council and their lobbyists are stuck in the early 90′s, and by the way, who wrote the bullshit on that site? I love where it says “Recalls are typically used to remove officials for corruption or malfeasance in office” UHHHH…No shit genius, the kelly thomas case isnt a perfect example of corruption by you bufoons? We all know without that tape, this incidenct would have been brushed under the rug. It is obvious, that when 6 cops murder a man in front of over 100 witnesses and they are not scared of being held accountable, something is extremely sour.In addition, these dumbshits left the cops on the street for an additional month after the murder? another favorite on their wesite is when they say “Fullerton is a peaceful family town. Let’s keep it that way and not let political opportunism threaten our city’s safety” Really? I live in South OC and am scared to death to go out in fullerton for fear of some bullshit charge or worse that I might get beat to death or my wife might get molested by a cop.
    Lastly, and the best part…at the bottom of the site it says “Supporters will be listed soon” and then there is nobody listed….how soon will that be? When you can find one or two people who aren’t in your pocket to come forward and support two ex corrupt cops and a goon from Texas with a Texas mentality? The whole site is directed to bash FFFF site, then they do you the biggest favor of all and actually mention your site and give them the web address….These three need to go just for their stupidity. Hey recall no people…when your site looks like it was developed by he haw himself, its probably not a good idea to give potential supporters the address to a site that just plain and simply kicks your ass…..

    For the corruption in the Kelly Thomas Scandal, coupled with their combined IQ of about 80, these three need to go…….One last word to be fair….You citizens of Fullerton should be ashamed of yourselves for ever letting these three monkeys take control in the first place. Especially that Jones reject, he can’t even speak!!!

  41. Police Apologist/OCDA Employee/Troll :
    The charges were filed. Stop asking questions like “why did the DA file a weak case?” or “why did they lie about receiving the coroner’s report on the 20th?”. Its over. End of story. Move on with your lives.

    Can I move on with my life if it means me and the other four FPD who have our get out of jail free cards put on OUR LATEX GLOVES and let you know we are “ready to F you up” and hit you without provocation?

    1. Sorry Texas Ranger, no disrespect. I apologize for a lack of a better term. What I meant by that is I can picture that goon sitting in a clan meeting back in texas in the 40 or 50’s and saying that the people disagreeing with him have a “lynch mob mentality”

  42. We Are All One :

    Anonymous :
    And apparently the police vehicle was 2 blocks away because he couldn’t hear his partner making the threats …yeah.

    Yeah, I thought that too. Shady.

    Three of the officers had their Digital Audio Recorders TURNED OFFFFFFFFF

    That should be grounds for dismissal right there.

    Just like the FPO who thought a little sexual assault would go good on his shift as long as he turned off his DAR

  43. Wow @ the OCR apparently backing the three blind mice with their shit article “Targeted council members in Fullerton gain support. ”

    LOL at them quoting McKinley, Tony Bushala “has been a bully in this city for years.”

  44. MeYou :

    We Are All One :

    Anonymous :And apparently the police vehicle was 2 blocks away because he couldn’t hear his partner making the threats …yeah.

    Yeah, I thought that too. Shady.

    Three of the officers had their Digital Audio Recorders TURNED OFFFFFFFFF
    That should be grounds for dismissal right there.
    Just like the FPO who thought a little sexual assault would go good on his shift as long as he turned off his DAR

    IS THIS TRUE?

  45. THE ENTIRE FPD HIGHER RANKS SAW AND HEARD EVERYTHING THE DA saw and heard (except witness testimony) and allowed these animals to continue working. FEDERAL INDICTMENTS FORALL FPD Leaders!!!

    1. The fix is in…

      “WE FILED CHARGES NOW SHUT UP AND STOP ASKING QUESTIONS!”

      On the surface is “sounds” great that the DA filed charges but once you look into it the holes, inconsistencies and lack of other charges you’ll begin to see that the true motives of the DA.

      I’d love to see you asks people for their thoughts after they really examine the DA’s case but you’re not going to do that because the purpose of this “story” is to cover for the DA and make them look great (like you usually do).

  46. DGG3: “its probably not a good idea to give potential supporters the address to a site that just plain and simply kicks your ass…..”

    Lol .. this.

  47. Did either Jay Cicinelli or Manny Ramos get the perp walk? Since I’ve been replaced by a glass eye, I couldn’t see if they gave them the perp walk or not.

    1. I had an old freind getting hasseled at a party by another guy with one eye, so My freind spits in his good eye then decked him for trying to start a fight.

  48. Yup, there are pictures of Jay Cicinelli and Manny Ramos in HANDCUFFS and being escorted out of the court room by sheriffs. That is the most awesome sight ever.

  49. We need to comb through EVERY SINGLE FPD sworn officer’s files. Are there others like Cincinelli? Are there other officers @ FPD that were fired from other agencies? We need to clean house. Perhaps a psych exam for all officers is order to establish a baseline NOW!

    1. “We need to comb through EVERY SINGLE FPD sworn officer’s files”

      Yes. This is what is actually necessary. But extremely hard to get an investigative body to do.

  50. Fullerton Citizen :
    We need to comb through EVERY SINGLE FPD sworn officer’s files. Are there others like Cincinelli? Are there other officers @ FPD that were fired from other agencies? We need to clean house. Perhaps a psych exam for all officers is order to establish a baseline NOW!

    OF COURSE THERE ARE. CHIEF SELLERS HEARD THE EVIL AUDIO AND DID NOTHING BUT EXIT ON TAXPAYER DISABILITY.

  51. larry on September 22, 2011

    Not to offend anyone with a vision disability,but next time you’re driving in traffic…cover one eye for just 15 seconds and imagine you are a police officer.
    It is a scary thought that Pat Mckinley knowingly hired this guy despite being half blind.
    This officer should of never been assigned patrol duty.

    Larry,
    When I first started working out in the gym many years ago, I had rust fall into my right eye from the weights; I could not see. This one night, it bothered me so much, I drove myself to the VA hospital in the San Fernando Valley; a distance of approximately 12 miles with my right eye closed. It was a scary drive, as I did not have any depth perception.
    Knowing this, I cannot even imagine what a city is doing hiring an officer who has only one eye. Many favors were called in on this one. Cicinelli would NOT pass P.O.S.T., (Police Officer’s Standards and Training), re-certification, nor would he pass the eye test, and he would also have to undergo a full physical exam given by a city approved doctor.
    Cicinelli was a lawsuit waiting to happen. It is a shame that someone had to die in the meantime, though he was only one of the 6 that participated in this murder. Damn them!!

  52. ” Under the Felony Murder Rule, Ramos could be charged with Second Degree Murder if a homocide (sic) (hahahahahaha) occured during his commision of a felony.”” Without the coroner’s ruling of homocide (sic) (hahahahahhahahahahahhaha) the murder rule would not have applied and Ramos would have had to of been charged with a lesser crime.

    Look everyone. I’m the smartest person in the blog/room/city/world. I know everything and you people know nothing. I just don’t understand it!! I just don’t get it!!!! I don’t know why I can’t make you understand ( with my deductive reasoning and all…and don’t forget my ASSumptions.)

    “Everybody loved me here when my posts conformed to the widely accepted group-think. It was only after I decided a few weeks ago that the DA would in fact bring serious charges, and as he said, very soon, that my position made me the enemy. I was asked repeatedly “who’s side are you on?”

    “This opinion of mine turned out to be entirely correct, I even called when the announcemnet would be made, but it definitely did not conform to the ‘do-nothing corrupt DA’ gospel preached here and I even called when the announcemnet would be made.”

    For the record…nobody loved you (except yourself-see narcissism). “It was only after I I,I,I,I,I, mem,me,me,me,me,me) decided….would bring serious charges soon (because I’m the smartest person in this blog/room/city/world!) “This opinion of mine turned out to be entirely correct”( I am ALWAYS correct. You don’t know it but I am always correct and you’re NOT!!! Why won’t you people just listen to me,me,me,me,me,me,me,me,me,me,me,me,me,me…AD NAUSEUM!!!!
    “I (I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,)even called when the announcemnet would be made” one other case I googled came in ‘EXACTLY’ in 10 weeks just like this one!!!! Does anybody even get how much I (I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,) can predict the future because….. (come on and join in everyone-I am the smartest person in this blog/room/city/world!!!

    NOW FOR THE ONLY REAL TRUTH IN THIS POST. MANY OF US HAVE BEEN ON THE RECORD WAY BEFORE YOU (na nanna boo boo we were first) in saying Kelly was MURDERED. (SEE HOMOCIDE(SIC) TEE HEE HEE.) WE WERE TOLD NOT TO RUSH TO JUDGEMENT BEFORE ALL THE FACTS WERE IN. THAT’S WHEN I (I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,,) WAS ON THE RECORD SAYING THAT BASED ON THE FACTS IT WAS MURDER (SEE HOMICIDE) BECAUSE I SAID SO!!!!

    1. This was supposed to show up as a quote. So the parts in quotes are attributed to none other than EYENEVERSAYNO THE GREAT ( I added “THE GREAT part because that’s how I (I,I,I,I,I,I,I,) feel.

  53. EyeNeverSayNo :
    “Wood shampoo’ is a very old joke that first made the rounds in so cal in the 80s. I did not threaten anyone or any business specifically. To now conveniently attempt to call it “violent inflammatory language” is not just a stretch, it’s absolutely silly.
    That being said, someone asked me to explain and I do indeed remember writing back “instead of explaining my dumb joke, why don’t you tell me…” and went on with the discussion. I don’t see it there now, so maybe it was on another thread, or there was a glitch in the system. It’s happened before. But in any case, “violent inflammatory language???” come on. Lame. Do better.

    Why don’t you just stick to the thread. You are acting very trollish in you diversionary tactics.

  54. Why was McKinley able to hire a man on disability from another PD? How was he able to hire a guy hooked on drugs, who happened to be the son of a sheriff? And on and on.

    I thought we had Civil Service and Union rules to prevent this kind of thing! I would like the City Council to address this, pronto.

    The basic problem with FPD seems to be that it’s a patronage job for McKinley and his peeps.

  55. “Every police officer knows you can’t threaten to beat someone up,” Rackauckas said. “You can’t say ‘I’m going to f— you up.'”
    I think Case Law says Police Officers can use threats for compliance. Any attorneys out there for an opinion?
    Ramos is being used as a scapegoat. Other Officers were involved. Ramos didn’t break Kelly’s nose, cheek & jaw. Either they all go to jail with reasonable bail or they all get arrested with high bail. Something is not right here.

  56. I’m told that there are a few Fullerton officers with only 1 eye. With the amount of pay these officers make, you would think we could pick up the best and brightest, instead of these rejects.

  57. Police still insist that they will not release a video showing their officers beat and taser Kelly Thomas, who died days later from his injuries, because they don’t want to influence any potential witnesses.

    What a crock!

  58. woow….fullerton Police have a history of being ASSSSSShol..es …and every body knows it. That is why I dont blame people who hate police officers in general.. They are ex -high school football loosers with an attitude. Pricks who were to stupid to get into a real college, and driven by there super ego. Jerks who think because of there size they can manipulate and demand respect…that is what makes up, the people we call to protect us..

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