Pam Keller Appears to Like Fake Old Buildings
Pam Keller seems to think it’s a good idea to make the new 6.5 million dollar subsidized McDonald’s look “more like the high school” than a “fast-food joint.” She appears to believe that a visual “upgrade” helps justify the huge expenditure of public money. We don’t think it’s an upgrade at all, but just another example of Redevelopment shoving crappy architecture down our throats. Strike two.
On the other hand, maybe Keller is hoping the architectural “blend” will keep people from noticing that the city spent 6.5 Million dollars on moving the McDonald’s 150 feet closer to the school!
Because of the health concerns caused from fast food, Sharon Quirk is said to be considering changing her vote. Maybe Pam Keller will too.
Read this Recent comment from:
#15 by The Enabler at May 16th, 2009
Right on, Frazier. And thank you Supervisor Norby, for your Fullerton legislative history update on the importance of vote-changing, when changing one’s vote is simply the right thing to do.
In one corner, a huge corporation, under guise of a local businessman; in the other, City of Fullerton, hoodwinked into abetting the feeding of malnutritious food to its young residents! On this issue, I must entirely side with Council members Jones and Nelson. McDonald’s shouldn’t receive ONE DIME from City of Fullerton! Long-term costs upon Fullerton’s citizens to provide financial assistance to this global firm are catastrophic!
By eating this food, Fullerton students become less prepared to excel at school, less productive citizens, and will suffer crippling long-term health problems! Obesity, cardiac distress, diabetes! This isn’t idle speculation, but medical fact! Our Latino population’s particularly susceptible to these complications! Not even to mention high civic costs to clean up paper and plastic waste, which is daily generated from this eatery!
I defend, though not happily, McDonald’s or any firm’s rights to build wherever it wants; pay the going rate, meet all governing local, state and federal rules and requirements.
But it’s just wrong for Fullerton to subsidize McDonald’s operation, in any way. Wrong for Fullerton to favor one company over another. Wrong for Fullerton to justify such future ugliness, in the name of civic beautification. Wrong for Fullerton to victimize its young, to enable old people feel good about themselves. Wrong. Wrong Wrong.
I strongly urge Council members Keller, Quirk, Bankhead to carefully reexamine their votes, and put Fullerton first! Put Fullerton first; provide a safe, healthy environment for its young! Put Fullerton first; cautiously rein in civic waste! Put Fullerton first; focus not on global corporate greed, but on local civic virtue!
Every time Fullerton citizens drive by Fox Theatre, and marvel at its future apotheosis as local cultural shrine, please think of thousands of Fullerton young children, teen-agers, young adults who’ll have paid the price to make this happen. Very soon, they’ll have even fewer steps to pick up their Egg McMuffins, Mcfries, and six dollar dollar Super-sized Big Macs.
It hardly seems possible!
Sorry to be so cranky. But I’m truly flabbergasted by this civic-inspired fiscal imprudence and grave social justice.
The Enabler
Wow, I’m not at all shocked by the fact that Keller likes fake old, it’s obvious she has no idea how important design plays in the history of a town. Fake old crap is a joke and is insulting to any intelligent person who has an appreciation for art and architecture.
Every time I think about this project, it gets a little more insane. Hope it’s not to late to fix this.
Just a guy, let’s hope that Pam and Sharon will come to their senses. It really is an absurd project, and I think they know that too!
Irving, welcome to Friends for Fullerton’s Future, what took you so long to find our blog?
The very thought of making the McDonald’s look “more like the high school” has a subtle streak of complicity, no? What’s the motivation behind that idea? So that it won’t be so glaringly obvious to the casual passerby that there’s an ubiquitous commercial enterprise perched right on the border of a Fullerton (“The Education Community”) High School?
What if instead they were trying to move a 7/11 over there, would they try to make that look “more like the high school” so that students can feel more comfortable buying cigarettes?
Mr. Peabody, would you like to write a post?
It is most interesting to me that the side of the aisle which would be most likely to codify what children can and cannot consume would disguise a McDonalds as a high school building. A veritable wolf in sheep’s clothing. I think the whole thing is brilliant. Dumping millions on a free McDonald’s to be moved onto the condemned property of former private homeowners on a promise to Angelo & Vinci’s in order to facilitate the incredibly successful Fox Theatre rehab project! Of course. It all makes fiscal and community sense. What are we, $8 or $10 million in to build an outdoor movie screen so that we can project Herbie the Love Bug on a hot summer night?
Oh, come on!!! It’s a fast food restaurant. Jeez people, if people want to eat McD’s, who are you to judge them? If kids eat it, then it is up to their parents to PARENT them. Oh, yes, I said it! YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR CHILDREN, not me, the City or MickyD’s! Lay off the “McDonalds is dangerous” crap. I’m sure you would hate it if a bike shop went in there because many kids are hurt on bikes. Jeeze….
Also, if Quirk really allows this crap influence her decision, she REALLY doesn’t get it! You cannot legislate personal freedoms. We have the RIGHT to buy McDs, smoke hooka or ride bikes… we are AMERICANS! TAKE SOME PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!!!!
Now, I DO hate fake old! The builders will only do what is asked. We should ask that a GREAT architect be engaged for this building. It doesn’t necessarily have to look like the HS, but compliment the whole area. They SHOULD NOT DESIGN FROM THE DIAS! That process takes a lot more time than the hour Council gives this item.
Jack, we don’t care if you supersize yourself everyday. In fact, the city is willing to pay you to do it.
They’ve picked up the tab for the acquisition of homes along Pomona and their demolition. They’re paying for the move and construction of the New McD’s for a business that doesn’t want to be moved! They’re paying for the countless architectural revisions too. Next up, they’ll pay a much larger chunk than agreed upon for that boondoggle The Fox, when it shows that it can’t raise the funds it needs. All in all, call this a financial bloodletting.
We are taking responsibility. It’s the city and its supporters who aren’t.
Enjoy your 9 million dollar burger!! Maybe you can wash it down with a 5 million dollar cocktail!
Jack be nimble -if we were only talking about design, that would be easy. A veritable non-brainer.
But you’ve missed the point of this entire issue, making it a “personal choice” issue, and dragging in parenting skills and now we hear swirls of “America The Beautiful” beginning to play.
Since you seem to need training wheels, we’ll spell it out for you. This is a fiscal issue. You have overlooked that by spending freely with our money, the redevelopment agency and the city councils have taken away homes from people, and are willing to spend millions on this. In the meanwhile, legitimate programs and projects go neglected within the city because of a “shortage of money.” It is also a design issue. What’s being built with redev. monies (aka your money) is architectural white bread buildings built to last 25 years. They’re not monuments to fresh ideas or movements, they’re cheap imitation products built of wall board and foam. Plus, they’re designed to make Fullerton look like Mission Viejo.
So spare us your political grandstanding, your Rush Limbaugh moments. FFF isn’t interested in people missing the point.
I wasn’t arguing the fiscal issues, but the “fake old” as the stated in the title of the blog entry.
Also, if your complaining about the move now, you’re too late. The deal has been struck. Complain about it and waste your time, or find something you can make a difference in.
I don’t like the architecture of the of Mission Vijeo and Limbaugh is even worse.
So in udder werds Jacky candlestick
We should just let this go by without mentioning it. That way nobody knows, nor will they know that this has happened before?
Hmmmmmm….. me thinks you really don’t give a rat’s ass about the fiscal issues at all. That would also put you with the side that think eminent domain is for things like burger joints that ironically have no desire to be moved.
Funny thing, if we all keep quiet about stuff like this (as has been the usual response) this is going to happen again and again. Nuttin’ will change. But that’s what dey’re banking(head) on.
As fer the fakey old, the old timey feel good, you can’t duplicate the scale and proportions of the high school. Whacha get is sorta like a pumped up car. Think Escalade.
How about a 2 Million dollar burrito? I’m sure the city could arrange that too.
Anonymous is right – if we don’t talk about the past we will repeat our failures over and over.
And it’s not too late to fix this issue. Quirk or Keller could put it back on the table.
Put what back on the table? The whole move? Really? Cummon… even you know that wont happen. With all the planning and activity around this to scrap it now??? Really…? You have no idea.
I’m not arguing for the move, but it has been done. Now we should focus on WHAT is going in there and HOW it looks. That is something within the CC pervue at the moment.
But arguing this whole issue “Because of the health concerns caused from fast food” is ridiculous. Like having McD’s 50 feet away is better…
Have you seen the plan for the area? What are we getting to move the business to the corner? Is there a master development plan for the area that will help DTF grow?
Have you seen the plan for the area? What are we getting to move the business to the corner? Is there a master development plan for the area that will help DTF grow?
All good questions you raise Jack. Listen to the developer talk, that’s the whole point, there is no plan. The plug needs to be pulled on this recognized boondoggle.
Yes Jack, it’s perfectly reasonable to take the project back to the drawing table. It’s called FIXING A MISTAKE. If it happened more often, our city would be a better place. Plodding ahead because we have momentum in the wrong direction is stupid, stupid, stupid.
Jack, there are a lot of people who don’t want DTF to “grow.” They believe that it has “grown” enough and would be just as happy to see the whole Fox “master plan” shit-dumped as nothing more than another staff-created cock-up that was appended to a genuine popular “Save the Fox” movement. A typical and cynical hijacking for its own purposes (activity – see below).
At this point step one is to leave Micky D’s where it is. If the so-called developer thinks that’s a deal breaker, then adios, and so much the better.
As to your statement about “all the planning and activity,” I really had to chuckle – almost out loud. For crissakes, there’s been almost NO planning, just a single scenario that kept metastacizing as one contingency was cantelevered off the one before. As to activity I can only share the observation that that’s what Redevelopment is there for. Not success, measured objectivey; but activity – lots of hustle bustle and who cares what the consequences are. As we have amply demonstrated on these pages, the consequences of Redevelopment “activity” have been bad. The less activity, the better for everybody.
save the fox project is blight and I blame it on all the morons who donated money and persuaded fullerton city council to save this nostalgic eyesore. I wish FFFF would do a blog on save the fox and list the clowns responsible for it. Everytime i drive by the fox theatre, I dont think entertainment. Instead I realize this dump is loaded with rats, other vermin and pee-soaked transients. I wont eat at angelo & vinci’s because it is part of the save the fox theatre. Yuck!!!
Van,
I totally disagree with you about the Fox. It’s part of this city’s history and deserves to be saved. If redevelopment can do anything good that the private sector can’t it is to save parts of our cultural heritage that might otherwise fall to the wrecking ball in favor of insipid condos that might have been built there (redev can also build those, of course).
I do agree with you that FFFF should do a post on the effort to save it however. I would like to know what is going on too.
van, there is a lot to be critical about the Save the Fox crowd, especially the surrender of critical thought to the entire process; the way the redevelopment staff hijacked the enterprise for their own ends; and the inevitable McSpanish McMonster that many of us could see coming.
But I disagree that the initial impulse to preserve a landmark was bad. It was just lacking any commonsensical input from anybody.
BY the time they’re done it would have been cheaper just to rehab the building and give it to a foundation to operate.
And on a more sinister note, there actually was a workable proposal to turn the Fox into a performing arts academy. That proposal would have probaby produced the best use for a white elephant, the best (least negative!) return, and required minimal redevelopment intrusion. Perhaps that was the reason it was rejected. And when I say rejected I really mean that the proposer was thoroughly slimed by Gary Chaplupsky and a consortium of boohoos who were offended that the guy had an affiliation with BIOLA. Oh the horror! A Christian!
If this plan had been pursued the result would probably have been no relocation of McDonalds, no acquisition of vastly over-priced houses on Pomona, no ham-fisted threats of eminent domain, etc., etc., etc. That 6 million could have gone to structural and seismic loans/grants.
But hindsight is 20/20!
Holy moly. Do you really believe DTF shouldn’t grow? OMG, you are NOT somebody to be in control. Reinvent, grow, expand or die.
I’m sure you think California was better “in the old days”. Jeeze….
Okay, so I love this blog, but uninformed and bigoted people like you have not place commenting on this or any other thing as you obviously have no idea what you are talking about. The building does not have homeless living in it. I am sure there are some vermin as there as there are in any metropolitan structure.
How does it feel to just shout out crap online? Good, I bet. Now, run for office. Make a difference. Get informed, then come back. Our community needs leaders not hecklers.
Okay, so I love this blog, but uninformed and bigoted people like you have not place commenting on this or any other thing as you obviously have no idea what you are talking about.
Jacky Candlestick –or we should say Jacqueline?
Who made you gatekeeper?
“And on a more sinister note, there actually was a workable proposal to turn the Fox into a performing arts academy. That proposal would have probaby produced the best use for a white elephant, the best (least negative!) return, and required minimal redevelopment intrusion. Perhaps that was the reason it was rejected.” Harpoon, I weet moy.
You’re right, Anonymous, I am not the gatekeeper. My comments could have come across that way and I apologize. Lets just be educated about this and stop perpetuating crap.
Jack, perpetual growth is an invitation for disaster. A biological analogy is gigantism. Oh, lots of people peddle “growth” as a Nineteenth century cure for what ails us.
Some of us are sick of subsidized developers getting their entitlements at our expense.
Pretty soon we wil be doing a series of post on the execrable mess the city has mad of the “Fox” project. And after you’re done reading it I’ll be interested to see if you stand by your statement about all the planning and activity that has gone into this fiasco.
BTW, without hecklers lookit all the great leaders Fullerton has produced. Maybe we hecklers can help usher in a a culture of accountability. That’s why we’re here.
Harpoon,
Things don’t have to get ‘bigger’ or more dense to grow as suggested in your analogy. “Growth”, in my opinion, isn’t only mass, but use and re-use, planning, infrastructure development, transportation and the like.
It is REALLY EASY to sit back and critique. The real test of a community leader is to offer alternatives and plans, not just complain about things. So what do you want to be, a leader or a heckler? Common, Harpoon, offer something.
Bullshit, Jack.
I am not a “community leader,” and have no aspirations in that direction; neither do I have an obligation to “offer something.” That’s how too many political “leaders” get in trouble – by feeling compelled to “offer something.” That’s why so many of Fullertons “leaders” have taken credit for the empty accomplishment of “revitalizing” downtown Fullerton. Since there were no hecklers, almost nobody else paid any attention. They were satisfied by barbara Giasone that all was well.
The only obligation I recognize (voluntarily) is the one that criticizes unpunshed failure – that goes on year after dismal year; and that requests accountability on the part of the elected and their staff.
BTW, if you meant all that stuff instead of simply “growth” you should have said so. In any case I don’t see much of that stuff going on with the Fox. Or City Pointe, the Pinnacles, Amerige Court etc,. etc. I see a few people getting really rich(er) building 5 story mosnsters and the rest of us getting screwed. I see downtown Fullerton transformed from a traditional commercial district to a residential one – with a bunch of bars appended. If that’s your idea of successful use and re-use that’s just dandy. But it ain’t mine, brother.
So there.
Jack, being critical is NOT so easy when you know what you’re talking about and write about it eloquently.
Instead of demanding “offers” of ideas from the Harpoon you ought to hustle on over to the next council meeting and demand responsibility and intelligence from the people you have voted for!
Hey Jack, you want action? Just stick around and I guarantee you’ll see something special. Taxpayers are mad as hell. They’ve been lied to, robbed and defrauded by every level of government, and now they know it. They want blood and they’re going to get it. Nothing exposes the underbelly of a fat bureaucracy like a big ‘ol recession, and this one is a doozy. But don’t get ahead of the boat, because right now we’re just throwing out the chum!
Oh, now I understand. Don’t worry about me any more, Harp, I’ll just look at your quotes like a puff of smoke; thinking it is fire, only to realize it’s nothing.
Jack you can look at my “quotes” any way you want to. If you actually read what I write I believe you’ll be the better for it, but that’s just my opinion. I am not in the “offer something” business, if by that you mean proposing solutions to problems intentionally created by our “leaders”; and nobody is paying me a massive salary and retirement to clean up after them, either.
You’ve got an elephant in your living room, Jack, and if I were you I wouldn’t be dwelling on solutions for removing the crap. First you have to acknowledge the elephant. That’s what we’re doing here. That’s the first step in getting it out of the house.
If you are satisfied that no criticism is valid without an accompanying “offer” of something constructive, then just go ahead keep riding the same old jackass and see where it takes you.
Jack, read Harp’s “quotes” again, and this time read it slow enough to understand the real meaning. There’s no smoke in them words.
Mr. Peabody, very good question. I believe the motivation behind that idea is that if the design resembles anything staff & company can recognize (McSpanish, stucco, styrofoam, fake think walls, fake second floors…), it must be good for Fullerton.
Maybe it’s fear, or lack of appreciation for creative design, there’s definitely something going on in F-Town that causes these decision makers to cling onto the nauseous design themes of the 90’s.