A Letter to Kelly
Sent in by a Friend:
Dear Kelly,
I know that whatever I say here is too little too late, but I must say it. I have to say thank you. I know that what happened that fateful night was nothing you had ever planned to have happen, and that there was nothing you could have done to stop the injustice that occurred to you. But I want you, and your family, friends, and supportive citizens to know that your death was not in vain. You have brought new life to a community by helping us to remember our pure humanity.
I may no longer be religious, but I retain an intense spirituality in which I hold true to many of the things I was taught as a child. One of my most remembered passages from the Bible is as follows: “As you have done it to these, the least of my brethren, you have done it unto me.” Although I always saw this as a positive passage, it reminds me now that there are two sides to every subject. You are in no way any less than any of us, except for in the way that our entrusted officers and government treated you because of who you were in their eyes. And I am so sorry that it took your death for us to realize that we all, as a community, had lost our power and needed to take it back.
Even with what happened tonight in our recall election, I wish that what had happened to you could be taken back a thousand times over. It should never have come to this. Tonight, the City of Fullerton stood up in defense of not just you, but itself, and it should never have taken your death for us to realize how much we needed to make change happen. There were so many more issues involved tonight, which we have known for so long but refused to challenge, and I am sorry that you had to be the catalyst to make change happen.
I am so wholeheartedly ashamed of how we let you down, but I hope that wherever you are, you somehow know that we will continue fighting for you, for our community, and for the rights of all of our citizens. I know that I, among many others, will continue to vigilantly make sure this never happens again to any member of our community, and should any injustice occur, that we will all work together to hold those persons accountable of the crimes they have committed.
All I can do tonight is look up at the sky and thank you, and I hope you that you can forgive us for all that has occurred. We love you, and we love Fullerton, and let this mark a new day in this city’s history and future.
With Love and Appreciation,
Your Town
Amen
Amen to this……….
http://www.kfiam640.com/player/?station=KFI-AM&program_name=podcast&program_id=BillHandel.xml&mid=22167785
Looks like Cicinelli wants to throw his co-defendant Ramos under the bus also whats with Huelsman talking about Cicinelli like he’s some 10 year old kid?
There is so much B.S in that interview. I wish someone could take time to deconstruct each thing he said.
Perfect!
No one could have said it better.
The Bible also tells us that angels come to us as beggars and strangers, and God watches how we treat them, as such. Be careful how you treat the stranger, and the beggar. You may be dealing with an angel, unawares.
Kelly was just one of us mortals, but I would not be surprised if he is an angel, now.
A theme we all should understand, as Christians:
The blood of innocents alone may cleanse us of our sins and errors.
I’m wiping tears from my eyes, because my brother was profoundly and severely autistic. He would not have survived the streets of Fullerton, as Kelly knew them. I understood my brother, and I knew how to work with him; But most people would not be prepared for some of the things he did, like once grabbing a handful of spaghetti off of an outdoor diner’s plate and shoving it into his face. We need to stop treating mental illness as a crime, and no more predatory, sadistic cops can be tolerated by a decent society!
Thank you, Kelly Thomas! You are a hero and a martyr in my eyes.
And besides a preacher named Wiley Drake from Buena Park, NOT ONE SINGLE PRIEST, PASTOR OR MINISTER FROM ANY SINGLE CHURCH, TEMPLE OR HOUSE OF WORSHIP IN THE ENTIRE CITY OF FULLERTON PUBLICLY SPOKE OUT AGAINST THIS BRUTAL MURDER. I guess these individuals don’t really believe in what they want you and I to believe in. Pretty spooky. It reminds me of the accounts of the church goers in Nazi Germany wiping the ashes off of the car windshields from the crematoriums while the ovens were going full blast. They knew. The Fullerton clergy are all cowards or assets period. Today’s silent pulpits are extremely dangerous to a nation that was born out of the pulpit. Those that fail to learn from history are destined to repeat it. Fullerton is no exception in spite of our recent renaissance. Stay the course Fullerton.
Right on! I didn’t read anything about any so called “preachers” stepping up and addressing this horrific crime! Are they afraid of the FPD? If so, let me remind you:
“What, then, shall we say in response to this? If God is for us, who can be against us?”
Romans 8:31
Truthseeker – once the “new” City Council is official, I would like to see the invocations offered by local clergy of all beliefs, rather than by council members. It annoyed me (for want of a stronger term) to see McKinley/Bankhead/Jones offering invocations – how dare they!
I just don’t want any of the ones from Fullerton that never bothered to give a damn about the brutal murder committed by the ones who have sworn an oath to protect us. Import some from out of town. The local clergy is not worthy unless of course they publicly repent of their cowardice.
Good idea. I however would not like to see any of Fullerton’s clergy in that capacity until they repent of their cowardice and how they have failed our community. Importing them from out of town is where I would like to see it begin and in doing so will send them a message.
Yes, hence “local” and “all beliefs”; I wonder what McKinley’s pastor is thinking now?
You know, I think I’m going write a post about that.
Wiley Drake should be invited to deliver the first invocation of the new council’s term-
I second the motion.
Pharasee’s are here just like they were in Jeruselem in the time of Christ.
So true, so true!
though the media has been slow to recognize it, we, the good people of Fullerton, made history with the recall heard round the world.
Our government, from municipal to federal, is addicted to passing laws and statutes that often only strive to regulate our lives’ minutiae. Our spendthrift levels of government constantly raise taxes on us to fund their pet projects and then tell us they are in unprecedented debt and we must give them more of our money.
And on the night of 5th July 2011, our municipal government that viewed us only as cattle branded their cash cows, let loose its police force to beat to death a disabled, homeless man.
Our civic leaders and its goon squad, the FPD, murdered Kelly Thomas because they saw him as an economic drag on the their redevelopment funded downtown booze courts.
Because our city council and police force did not honor the law of the land, our Bill of Rights and our Constitution that proclaims government’s role first and foremost is to protect our individual rights, they did not believe the murder of Kelly thomas at their hands would garner attention or care from us. After all, our civic leaders and police force viewed us as cattle or the enemy to be poked and prodded into continued submission.
And eleven months after our city council and police force beat Kelly thomas to death, the good people of Fullerton proved the adage “you can’t fight city hall” is a myth. We fought city hall and won back our right to be respected and treated as humans not cattle.
just my opine
I should clarify my statement: It seems that the blood of innocents alone seems to be the catalyst that brings us all to shame and repentance. We went wrong as a society when we began to selfishly and blindly cry out for “law and order”, demanding the death penalty and such like. This is the rhetoric of the law enforcement and prison industries, and we bought into it. Now, we are reaping the bitter harvest. Look up Rose Bird, the CA Surpreme Court justice who was taken off the bench. She stood for civil liberties. She stood in the gap, protecting the citizens from the danger of a rising police state. We need to see the power of forgiveness and repentance. It’s a two way street. We live in a nation of laws, and people have to be held accountable for their misdeeds. People need to be responsible for their crimes and errors, and especially the police (who should know better, but want to be indemnified of all their wrongs). Street beatings and executions are NOT justice! Anyone should realize that mental illness is a reality, and the mentally ill are not disposable “trash”. They are family and beloved to someone. Kelly’s tragic, brutal death is the kind of thing that happens when we indemnify authorities (police and administrators) and when we become so wanton and selfish in our expectation of a perfect, safe life that we begin to take a summary judgement “hang ’em high” view on criminal offenders. Some are mentally ill, and others have drug and alcohol problems. Many can be helped. It’s not about being a “bleeding heart liberal”. It’s about being a human being. The next police brutality victim could be YOUR child! How many compassionate conservatives are there, out there, who will stand up for civil liberties? Just remember, if you are a Christian, that we are ALL sinners, and that Jesus was crucified next to two common criminals, one of whom he assured would be in heaven with Him, that day. Who will throw the first stone? I do think that there is hope for all of us to reform. Public opinion seems to be changing, and it couldn’t come at a better time, at the approach of a big election cycle. The Democrat Socialists stand for unions, and you see what comes of that. Vote appropriately. Your future will depend on it.
There is another thought that the death penalty is the ultimate recognition of the value of life. One who callously and maliciously takes the life of another ought to, by justice, give up of his own that which he determined to take from another.
That is, of course, by the sober decision of society, under due process and with conviction beyond a reasonable doubt.
The steet execution of a mentally ill man is a different issue altogether.
I love every word.
Yes, amen and thank you Kelly for paying the ultimate price for change…
That is what knowingly or unknowingly (instinctively) and unconditionally the true heroes do!
I hope that soon there will be a bronze bust in the City Hall somewhere to depict Kelly’s courage to defend himself against the evil.
Truthseeker, you are right. You will likely not find Jesus in these cold buildings with all their icons and stained glass. Jesus is in our hearts, if we open the doors and repent. Those who love truth should have nothing to fear of Jesus and will welcome Him in and make a place for Him in our lives. All who love Jesus and have given Him a place in their hearts ARE the church. The churches have housed abominations, and are not without stain and sin. That said, they have also brought many to Jesus Christ and have made our mainly Christian societies, over all these years, more more bearable and decent. Here, I can make use of a metaphor. You can take a clean vessel and put filth into it, and unless it is washed clean, anything you put into it will be contaminated and unsafe to drink. The miracle of the church is that it has been defiled, and yet has more often than not been instrumental in cleansing the corrupt which have come into it. So, let’s not dismiss the good of churches. But, I think you can understand that the act of going to church is not going to change you and cleanse you, if you don’t first open up your own heart. Any church can be made better with a good congregation who are there for the right reasons. Fifty years ago, civic leaders and businessmen went to church largely to be seen by others. It would be better to study scripture in secret, really.
I don’t want to go on about religion and my views on it. There is much good coming from the church. The church fails us, sometimes, yes. Do we not also fail it?
Rip kelly!!! Justice will be served!!!
I am sure Kelly’s suffering is over, he bore the cross God gave him to bare. His work here was done, he is with the other Angels now.
I can hear several people saying what’s in this letter. Unable to pinpoint one specifically, I’m content with how it was signed and that it speaks for me, too.
Rest in peace, Kelly. May it never happen again.
Amen.
Does anyone remember that great movie, “The Wizard of Oz”? Do you remember the scene where Dorothy accidentally spills water on the Wicked Witch of the West? The shrieking witch melts into a pile of empty witch-garb, and dies, whereupon Dorothy and her little company of friends are terrified at what will happen next. They are surrounded by fearsome guards with bearskin hats and lances. They fear for their lives, because they have killed the witch! What happens next comes as a big surprise: The captain of the guards bows down at Dorothy’s feet. The guards are grateful to be released from the evil!!!
When some of these old books were written, they were full of allegories and metaphors for the real world.
Here is something that most people do not know about police: The GOOD ones (yes, there are some) who love justice and really want to do something good for society, end up between a rock and a hard place. They have to toe the mark for the mean, crooked cops who are often promoted by corrupt administrators (because they get “results” and play into corruption schemes), and the potentially good cops have to sideline their better instincts and impulses, because this is very much a team effort, and anyone who speaks out or tells the truth can become a target of harrassment, shunning, set-ups and black-listing. It can pose a terrible dilemma for the ethically minded amoung them. They are no different than you or I. They have kids in school, mortgages, car payments, etc. What would you do? Would it not eat you up, inside? Any wonder that some of them commit suicide? There would be a lot of reasons for that, but a guilty conscience is relentless.
I know (by innuendo, but very credible innuendo) that there are decent police who are pressured to “resign”, under threat that they will have their careers messed up so badly, they’ll never be able to work in law enforcement, again. If this isn’t the sign of a corrupt police department, then I don’t know what is!
Ever wonder why there are so many police and other agency employees at the scene of an arrest? It’s so that the prosecutors can switch witnesses and not run out by trial, sort of like having a team of 15 polo ponies to win a match. If one is not useful or willing, he or she gets swapped out.
I’m not trying to condemn all prosecutors or police. I do have a lot of respect for some of them, and I know that a lot of them don’t like it, they way things are. The system works in a certain way, and it is not always serving justice. It’s tainted by the politics of special interests and years of accumulated bad practice. It seriously needs reform, and that could really happen almost overnight with more public awareness.
Pray for our nation, and pray for good public servants, everywhere. No one should have to feel bad about their job. Public service should be something to be proud of.
No one person can solve it and we need to stop looking to politicians to issue soothing words, promises, dole and bandaids. We all need to form strong communities and re-examine everything, starting with our own lives.
Well said. Thanks for sharing with us, Tony.
My pleasure Tricia, sharing is caring.
I just threw up…….a lot!!
I have nothing of substance to say so I’m typing out this pointless message about expelling…… bodily fluids!
I would like to sign on to that.
I think it was said here, and I know it is true, that the youth ministry at St. Angela Merici in Brea, (not exactly the hot bed of activism) discussed this at length and debated the justice surrounding Kelly’s death.
Social Justice seemed important to the young priest and his discussions were heartfelt, aggressive and brutally honest. Himself a refugee, it was impactful to say the least.
But, its fair to say, the debate never left the teen center and certainly never made it to the pulpit. Maybe it was politics, maybe it was something else.
What we do know, is that FFFF taught us that we can and to a lesser degree how to stand up. In this case it was clear, we were fighting for the weakest among us, that passion for humanity drove otherwise pre-occupied people to stand up and talk, scream and fight back!
Perhaps Fr. Tran and the kids in St. Mary’s room will take away from this that injustice needs to be questioned. That there is NOTHING WRONG with questioning our elected leaders. In their answers will lie our answers and there will be THE ANSWER
Wow- that was overly poetic.
SOCIAL JUSTICE!
I think what makes a person great is what he leaves behind so it can live on -Kelly left footprints in the sand, and they point in a commendable direction- he has made life better for those everywhere and has touched my life for the better in all ways and forever.
Until justice is fully achieved for Kelly, there will be no stopping and, with all confidence, the Kelly Thomas name and accomplishments will be passed on for a long time, from one to another.
I think I would be a great idea to have Kelly’s footprint engraved in a bronze mold on the sidewalk where he was killed, as a symbol that he will never leave, that he had as much right as any of us, to walk those streets. Also, as a memorial honoring the less fortunate and their right to live. Kelly will live on forever and he should be immortalized in a cast, I feel.
Eight lawful commands ignored, after having been caught lifting door handles in the Slidebar parking lot. Kelly is responsible for his own demise. One less bum on the streets breaking into cars and stealing mail — oh, the tragedy , cry me a river.
http://friendsforjay.org/
You keep posting the same trash over and over again. Kelly did not ignore eight lawful commands nor was he caught lifting door handles in the Slidebar parking lot. You are a very sad and godless person.
Yeah, Thanks Kelly for that big stinky turd you took in front of my business!
Anonymous, I’d like to know where’s your business is at so I can take one there too?
You are a COWARD!! Put your real name up! You are just a stain . A bully and tormentor to the memory of a deceased murdered person. How dare you come on here to do nothing more than inflict more emotional pain on family and friends of kelly thomas? Who are u to sit behind an anonymous name and post such insensitive messages? You are most likely a family member of the killers and that would NOT surprise me.Cowards always hide behind something. Whether its a badge or a computer. Cowards are only brave enuf that way. U also wouldnt give ur name becuz you know you cant justify your nastiness .. People like ur are a disgust to the society!!!
8 commands? What were they? Go ahead !!!
You my dear will burn in hell.
Have some sympathy for her Tex. Her one-eyed meal ticket has expired. Con you imagine just how scared this stupid bitch is?
And how many times did Cicinelli unlawfully smash Kelly’s face with the taser?
8.
“Ignore that daft cow behind the curtain.”
the proper term is daft cunt,(taken from Trainspoting)
That’s not what the Wizard was quoting.
Nice. Throw the Slidebar under the FPD squad car.
The truth is coming.
Lisa,
May I call you by your real name, Trina?
“Oh, the tragedy” will be your words, when Jay’s legal expenses BK the family.
Once convicted, Jay will lose his pension, serve time in jail and be virtually unemployable upon release.
Jay’s too old and out of shape for private security and his felony conviction just may impact his ability to own firearms.
You and Jay are the laughing stock of your church and community with that friendsforjay website
Your actions define who you are and calling Kelly a bum defines you as a person.
Good luck with that Lisa as your God has a special plan for you and your evil heart
Ahh, Orange Cape, nicely put. You have to wonder why lowlifes like that even come here. Misery loves company, I guess, but really, the likes of that should not leave their slime where they’re not wanted. Next time they’re in church (seriously???) they should ask for a good old fashioned exorcism then do us all a favor and offer themselves as sacrificial lambs to be slaughtered on the alter.
Even IF he ignored 8 lawful commands (which he did not), it does NOT equal being beaten to death!!!!! Shame on you! Shame Shame Shame!
A page if fiction is all your link took me to!!!
RIP Kelly. Iam truely sorry for your suffering this should have never happened to a human being.
This topic has brought tears to my eyes and feelings in my chest. But, the truth stands. Not one of our leaders of any Church in Fullerton has said anything. This is very sad.
RIP KT, your job as been completed.
I couldn’t have said it any better………….
Cheers my friend.
I was at the transportation center today and lo and behold – the benches are back at Kelly’s Corner. I’m not sure when they were reinstalled but it was nice to see that it was done.
Ha! What a wonderful thing the Recall is.
thank you for that info
Ain’t it just!
lisa your gonna be crying when your jay bird is locked up, Oh Yea its gonna happen. AND EVERY ONE KNOWS WHAT HAPPENS TO PIGS IN JAIL…………..maybe you should get the show OZ on DVD
Firstly, I do not need to hide behind a false name. I am Lori. I have bipolar disease. Kelly was not a bum that your society deemed unloved or unwanted. Our friends and family live us regardless of our mental afflictions. This leads me to a point that I stand behind firmly: society (including police) commit attrocious acts against humanity when they think no one is watching. Police are public servants. To serve and protect all citizens. The crimes committed against Kelly and countless others are acts of hate. I work with homeless youth and every day is a challenge. The police trying to bust your skull is just one of the many dangers they face. When you have a mental illness and the world is a bit skewed, come back and let’s have a compassionate conversation about Kelly’s murder. Thank you, Lori
So now you guys care about me!!!
Let’s see. What would inspire someone to take on the moniker of murdered man, and then with all this offensive power only manage to eek out one lame ass line like this. I will be happy to introduce you to someone that cared about Kelly. Hi, I did. I use my real name with everything I say, as I was born with a very unique trait, I do not fear turds like you. Contact me and I will introduce you to a several dozen people that cared about Kelly, while he was alive. I have no idea who you are. You could be a former council person, you could be a current police officer, you could be a fat, unemployed, chronic pedo, living away his days in front of an old sticky PC in his mothers garage with hillbilly overalls permanently around your ankles. Whichever of these you are, to me you are just one more turd floating down stream in the blogosphere. Too dumb to be clever. Too uninformed to be insightful. To depressed to be engaging, to ugly to get laid and to callous to know that what you find funny, the world at large finds pathetic. If you are going to be an ass, at least go big, you suck at even that. My offer to meet with you in genuine, you may come in or out of uniform, but I will not be seen in public with anyone in overalls. Now go F*ck yourself. Respectfully. Baxter
They didn’t give a damn about you when you were alive Kelly, back then you were just another “bum” to them (and of course really, that’s all you ever were, a worthless shitbag). They just chose to latch on you to pursue their political agenda and to destroy good men like Jay and the other officers and the rest of our city leadership.
Kelly’s memory is just a tool to be used and exploited by people who would spit on him if he were alive today bugging them for “change” on the streets.
Oh, Kelly’s father didn’t care much about him either back then, just abandoned him to die on the streets. But now there are lots of $$$$$ to be made, so he cares now. His mom already took her payout … ka ching! $$$$$$$$$
http://friendsforjay.org/
I know I should take the high road and not respond to you, but if Jay is a “good” man – how can you ever justify him beating Kelly Thomas multiple times with a taser (and that’s been pretty much documented, Lisa)? Do you consider yourself a “good Christian” and yet use terms like “s…..g”? Do you kiss children/family members with that mouth?
Lisa , please please come to texas! Id luv to meet u in the street! Ur a disgusting piece of shit
This from that “friends for Jay” site:
“Many words have been used to describe Officer Jay – Dependable, Professional, Composed, Articulate, Courageous, Good Judgment Skills, Dedicated, Leader, Mentor, Experienced, Determined, Trustworthy, Integrity and Honest.”
You’re going to have to add the word “murderer” to that there list of ‘traits’.
Lisa, I’m sad for you. Get well.
Hahahaha, Lisa, you’re the one crying a river. Good men like Jay??? Excuse me while I puke. You’re a sick joke
Reality Is is Lisa. I can smell him a mile away; he STINKS like rotten eggs.
Hey Lisa, YOU ARE A SICK, HEARTLESS BITCH!!!! Gee, I just wonder how you would feel, if that were YOUR SON, or brother, or father, or anyone you loved, and cared about???? But, then again, you`re so blanking cold, and heartless, that , THAT scenario probably would`nt even phase you either!!!! Kelly was NOT lifting door handles, or doing ANYTHING ILLEGAL. hE WAS SITTING ON A BENCH MINDING HIS OWN BUSINESS!!!! THOSE ROTTEN COPS JUST HAD A PLAN, THEY WERE GOING TO DO, ”THAT NIGHT”, WITH THE HELP OF ”THE SLIMEBAR”, THEY WERE GOING TO ”GET THEIR KICKS”, AND BE THE ”TOUGH GUYS” THAT THEY ARE IN THEIR OWN MINDS, AND, IN WHICH THEY KNEW THEY COULD GET AWAY WITH ANYTHING!!!!! BECAUSE COPS MOST ALWAYS DO!!!! IF YOU CANNOT SEE THRU THEM, TJEN YOU ARE JUST AS SICK AS THEY ARE!!!!!! MAY THEY ”ROT IN HELL”, AND YOU TOO!!!!! THEY COULD NOT HAVE DONE A BIT MORE OF HARM TO KELLY, HAD HE BEEN ARMED & KILLED ONE, OR MORE OF THEM. AND HE WAS NOT…..EVEN ARMED!!!!! WHAT IN GOD`S NAME, DID HE DO TO DESERVE WHAT THOSEROTTEN ROGUE COPS DID TO HIM???? AND, BY THE WAY, DON`T YOU THINK EVEN ONE OR TWO OF THEM ( AT MOST), COULD`NT HAVE JUST CUFFED HIM, & TAKEN HIM IN??? THEY SURE COULD HAVE….. BUT THAT WAS NOT THEIR ”PLAN” FROM BEFORE THEY EVEN ”ROLLED-UP”, THAT WAS TOO EASY, AND NOT NEARLY ENOUGH FUN!!!! ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY KNOW THAT THEY CAN GET AWAY WITH ANYTHING, ANYTIME,ALL A COP HAS TO SAY IS: OH, I FELT THREATENED, OR OH HE REACHED FOR HIS WAISTBAND, OR…HE LOOKED AT ME CROSS-EYED, AND I DID`NT LIKE THAT, CUZ…… ”I`M A COP”!!!! MAY ALL THE BAD ONES BURN IN HELL, AND SOUNDS LIKE YOU SHOULD JOIN THEM!!!!!
You are a disgrace to the brotherhood. You are the one that hides behind the badge. You have shit for brains. Nah..you are not a cop, just wished you had been one. But with that mentality, you are to stupid to ever be one. Dream on!
jay the cripple is a murder and a lill’ bitch!!!
trina, trish, and lisa are delusional dumb fucks,
JAY IS GOING TO JAIL————-NO DOUBT ABOUT IT
I don’t think so..jerk!
Beatin your ass John Doe would be a public service in reality!
John Doe is Jay Cicinelli.
When he first started posting here he could barely type out a coherent sentence but obviously someone is helping him now that we’ve caught on.
I also noticed in his scrambled mind he believes he will be back on patrol with Fullerton PD when all of this is over.
WELL IN FULLERTON You can be mentally retarded and have one eye and be a PIG.
One thing Jay Cicinelli does not have is ethics! Maybe he has other traits that his sister thinks are necessary for a policeman. However, ethics is not one of them. First, he was shot in the eye in LAPD. Next he receives a $48,000 per year disability pension tax free, so thats worth about $60,000 per year. Instead of going back to school (he was young then), or to training for another profession, he joins the Fullerton PD knowing he cannot pass any physical proficiency test. He then goes into patrol which requires driving a car in emergency situations – again with one eye! Then he is involved in arrests, etc. which put his good eye at risk, even a minor injury there and he is partially to mostly blind. Yikes, what an idiot! All this could have been prevented if Jay or his sister, had ethics!
“Brotherhood”? That’s a laugh. Scumbaghood is what you are ~ ugly inside and out
maybe this sick person….”lisa” isnt even a ”lisa”, maybe it`s a ”richard” ( or a ”DICK” ) you know??!! Probably another ”rogue cop” or ones wife????? but who really cares!!!! Anyone with even HALF a brain, can see the injustice, & totally uncalled for tragic death these rotten cops put Kelly through. But , then again… SOME people don`t even have half a working brain!!!!!! Too bad, he or she IS entitled to their retarded opinion though!!!!!
Lisa, I know that Friends For Jay professes a trust in God. What quotes from the Word of God define Kelly Thomas as a worthless shit bag? What quotes from the Word of God define Jay, the other officers, and the rest of the City leadership as good men.
Perhaps you are using some definition other than Judeo-Christian philosophy. Perhaps you are using relativism.
If she is for real which I personally find difficult to believe then we have a whole new level of evil we are facing. Can anyone confirm that she is not just a plant trying to rouse hate speech and threats?
what would you expect from the sister of a murderer?
HEY TONY WHAT HAPPENED TO MY COMMENTS? ERASED THEM AGAIN CAUSE YOU DIDNT LIKE WHAT I WROTE? YOU ARE A BIG PIECE OF TURD. YOU CAN DISH IT OUT, BUT YOU CANT TAKE IT.
hey jay go give your with another black eye and blame it on your toddler.
Wife not with!!!
He’s not erasing them fast enough for me ~ crybaby
To the friend that posted this letter: your memory of the parable by Jesus is positive, but it was not necessarily meant so by Jesus. It was illistrative that judgement is not based upon our public image or our world, but what we actually do in the simple decissions in life.
Jesus said to the righteous who were to be saved that that he was hungry and they fed him, he was thirsty and they gave him drink, he was naked and they clothed him. The righteous protested that they had never done these good things for him. Jesus instructed that when they had done it to “the least of them”, they had done it to him.
Contrary, Jesus told another group that he was hungry and they did not feed him, he was thirsty and they did not give him drink, and that he was naked and they did not clothe him. The unrighteous countered that they had never seen Jesus in that condition. Besides, they had done great things in teaching the words of Jesus and had even cast out demons in his name. But Jesus told them to depart from him (to condemnation), for he knew them not. When they had declined to do these things for “the least of them” they had declined to do it for him.
Parables can not be taken too literally. One can not earn a place in salvation by giving food, drink, and clothes away to the poor. Certainly, one can not earn salvation by demanding that government tax the wealth of producers and give food, drink, and clothing to the poor.
What the parable does mean is that Jesus does not judge a person by his response to meeting Him revealed in all of His Glory. He judges a person according to how he treats people in his daily life, even “the least of them”.
Lisa has a point. Those who did not care about Kelly or people like him will recieve no respect from Jesus for hopping on the bandwagon after his death. I am not going to judge Lisa for referring to Kelly as a worthless dirtbag–I will leave that to The Judge.
The point is, the people who treated Kelly kindly and appropriately, wanting the best for his soul, while he was alive are those who will be honored by Jesus. This is irregardless if the caring souls are fellow homeless people or the top professionals around town.
I don’t know about jumping on the bandwagon.
It is our civic responsibility to make sure our government is by the people, and for the people. Out of control thug cops who act like they’re in a gang is a problem we ALL need to step up and take care of. It is a goddamn shame it took a murder to get so many of us to realize that our police department is out of control, but now we get it.
The recall happened and Lisa and John Doe can cry about it as much as they want. Next up the FPD is going to get disinfected or disbanded. The people of Fullerton – believers, atheists, or agnostics – are trying to banish the evil of police brutality and misconduct from our town. If Kelly were alive, and we all wish he was, I’m sure he would appreciate the struggle we wage for him and anyone else like him who was victimized by those are supposed to serve and protect.
Lisa, I called Dan Hughes and asked him a question at the behest of Friends For Jay. This question was: did he originally watch the soundless video on a small screen or on a 50-inch screen. He retorted that the claim that he watched it on a 50-inch screen was false.
I asked him two questions of my own. My main question was if we could see the evidence of the nightly prior encounters that Manny Ramos referred to and know who, if anyone, called the police to encounter Kelly ob these nights. This is pertinent to the point of how the police department and the business community was treating “the least of these (worthless shitbags).”
Will Friends For Jay support me in the answer to my request? Dan says that is part of the DA investigation and it is off limits. I mused that I perhaps should file a Freedom of Information request or call my friend at the DA’s office.
I read somewhere, probably on this blog that Lisa is Jay Cicinelli’s brother. I’m not surprised that she would make such crass, heartless comments. Seeing as how her brother is a psychopath.
Lisa, you do realize that everything you put on the internet stays there FOREVER, right? Every idiotic comment you make. Every sick, heartless thing you have said is going to come back to haunt you. For years. Now, I had said when all this first happened that the officers’ families should be left out of this because it was not their fault, and they were innocent. Well, not you.
I’m going to copy and paste every comment you have made here. Everyone is going to know about the sister of Jay Cicinelli. He is a psychopathic, one-eyed monster and former cop who brutally beat an innocent man to death. And his sister is an evil heartless bitch.
I’m going to copy and paste your comments everywhere…Facebook, YouTube, everywhere. Perhaps I should take a little trip to Fullerton and La Mirada, and print out a few fliers and post them around? We can let people know what the sister of Jay Cicinelli has said about Kelly Thomas. I’m really sure that people would really like to know. Everyone is going to know the kind of person you are.
Your name is going to be just as infamous as Jay Cicinelli’s.
…I just took a screenshot of your comments, Lisa.
I’m surprised Jay’s lawyer hasn’t told you to STFU.
Maybe he will now, after your comments are plastered all over the Internet.
I believe Lisa is really Trina, Jay’s wife, by comparing the writing style on the friendsforjay website.
Well, I had heard that Jay Cicinelli’s sister had said some really nasty things to someone in Kelly’s family (maybe his sister) in the restroom during a city council meeting. And I’m pretty sure they said Cicinelli’s sister was named Lisa.
I’m amazed that she would actually use her real name here. But her brother is a psychopath, so maybe it runs in the family. They keep talking trash about Kelly Thomas (how low can you get)…but really, they’re more insane and dangerous than he ever was.
Your last sentence is more true than many have comprehended. For everything these sick inviduals say about Kelly…the ones who savagely beat him to death are are way more sick in the head and far more dangerous than Kelly ever was. These fools that have judged Kelly and say all these horrible things about Kelly do not realize that in using the same logic and judgment as them, they crucify Cicinelli, Ramos, etc far worse.
…But either way, whether it is his sister or his wife posting the comments, it’s definitely not helping Jay’s situation any! They’re just digging him deeper and deeper.
I think it’s Trina too. Or possibly his sister.
I presume admin already tried to do an IP trace like he did with Ellis and it came back to a commerical service too many people use. Otherwise, we would have seen the smoking gun by now.
Ditto with John Doe. I don’t think he’s some random troll. He’s got some sort of investment in this.
John Doe is but one of the screen names of a well-known poster to this blog.
At least Cicinellis family will still be able to see their loved one, on visiting days of course, and speak to him via collect calls.
Sad to see supporters of justice for Kelly Thomas sinking to insulting Cicinelli for having a disability and preaching about Jesus. I’m not sure how either of those is helping the cause. I do know that when I read Cicinelli being called cyclops/crippled, or his wife or whomever Lisa is being called a cunt, it displays a lack of ability to regulate emotions. I too am sickened by the actions of Cicinelli and that someone has such disregard for a murder victim as to refer to him as a “worthless shitbag.” But I am not going to lower myself to the level of the criminals and their apologists.
@ Lisa: It’s sad that you and your family did not care enough about Jay to get him the help he needed after he lost his eye. Perhaps if he had received some/better counseling he would not have felt the need to bash in the face of a handcuffed, mentally ill man who was being pinned down by several accomplices. At least Kelly Thomas’s family acknowledges he was mentally ill and tried to get him help. What did you do to get your sick husband/brother/friend help after being shot in the face?
shit i’m blind in my left eye (still got a real one though), And I still say fuck that cyclop mother fucker
CICINELLI PUT OTHER OFFICERS AND THE PUBLIC AT RISK WHEN HE PATROLLED THE STREETS OF FULLERTON. THIS IS WHAT YOU MORONS DON’T GET!
…AND I BELIEVE JESUS SAID TURN THE OTHER CHEEK NOT BASH A GUY’S HEAD IN WITH A TASER!
IF SINCINELLI WAS A TRUE FOLLOWER OF JESUS AND NOT SOMEONE JUST EXPLOITING RELIGION FOR HIS OWN GAIN, HE WOULD HAVE STOPPED THE BEATING RIGHT THERE AND THEN!
THEN THIS SAINT CICINELLI BRAGGED ABOUT IT AT THE SCENE AND BACK AT THE STATION …YEAHHH A REAL FOLLOWER OF JESUS.
…Give me a break!
You’ve already lowered yourself to the trash who nitpick over minutia as a way to defend these murderers.
Jay Cicinelli is a dangerous psychopath. He has probably been a ticking time bomb for years, and that might be the REAL reason why the LAPD didn’t want him back. Someone recognized he had serious psychological problems, beyond PTSD.
Granted, what happened to him, when he was shot, was horrible. But there is no way that would not have caused serious brain damage. If the frontal lobe of his brain was damaged, which is a definite possibility, that would cause lingering and perhaps permanent effects. He would lose impulse control and his entire personality would change.
I have a friend who was in a horrible car accident a couple of years ago. Miraculously, he survived. But he had serious head injuries. I think he had a couple of skull fractures, and a subdural hematoma. He has recovered, and if he saw him today you would have no idea anything happened. He looks and talks completely normal. But after you spend time with him for a while, you’d notice some subtle signs that the accident has changed him. His memory has been affected, and he tends to forget things a lot. It’s usually nothing really important – but often he’ll forget things that he has said in conversations. Sometimes, it leads to arguments because he will completely deny saying something that several people heard him say. He literally will just not have any memory of it. He has also become a little bit “colder” and he tends to have mood swings. He gets mad easily. He has gotten a lot better, but I can tell there are a lot of lingering effects. If you talked with him, he would seem perfectly normal. But I know he has problems.
But then, my friend hasn’t beaten anyone to death. Jay Cicinelli did.
So here’s the big question…was Jay Cicinelli already a psychopath before he was shot? Or did it turn him into one because of brain damage?
He could have fooled people, because even with brain damage he would have appeared completely normal. He could carry on a normal conversation. But below the surface, with a damaged frontal lobe, he was a ticking time bomb. He was, and is, dangerous.
If I were the wife I would get the hell out of there before he finds out that he won’t be a cop anymore.
Can a guy with a TBI legally own a gun?
Bradon,
As far as I know, Jay never preached about Jesus, and he sure as hell wasn’t following Jesus on the 5th of July.
I got no beef with Jesus. I got a problem with hypocrites like Trina who think that quoting from the bible – after the fact and out of context, no less – absolves them of all sins. You will note Jesus also had a problem with this phenomenon.
Admiting your sins and asking for forgiveness should be the path to salvation. Neither Jay or Trina have done this. If they did, it probably wouldn’t stop the people here calling for his head, but it would make their religion less of an issue to be mocked.
He’s facing four years. Less if he cuts a plea. Either way, it’s less of a punishment than he actually deserves. Let’s cut the crap.
“There were so many more issues involved tonight, which we have known for so long but refused to challenge,” A beautiful letter but I disagree with the above comment. We did not know until after Kelly Thomas was beaten to death by the FPD that FPD had a recent history of civil rights abuses, most committed under their police chief’s watch, Pat McKinley, and that the good people of fullerton unknowingly bought legal hush in the form of settlements to FPD’s victims. Fullerton’s city council repeatedly authorized Fullerton tax revenue be diverted from its infrastructure to buy off the FPD’s inhumanity to the community it promised to serve and protect.
I’m leaning more toward the theory that “Lisa” is actually Jay’s sister Jill and not his wife Trinia
Jill Cicinelli’s Facebook page http://www.facebook.com/jill.cicinelli
Jill could possibly be a Christer herself – among her interests as listed on her Facebook page are, in no particular order, NASCAR, The Bible, and Starbucks.
There’s also a page up for her restaurant
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Cicinellis-Pizza-N-Pasta/116018275092488
Never been to the restaurant, but supposedly the chow is pretty good, if the reviews on Yelp are any indication. Although I’ll bet if she knew that one of her customers was an FFFFer, they could expect a certain amount of mucous in their Marinara.
Wouldn’t she be so excited to see folks in front of her restaurant with signs about the beating death of Kelly Thomas? Might have an impact on what she says and does! Just a thought…..
Oooh, DQ! I like that! Perhaps pass out flyers to their customers with her quotes from here on it. I’m sure they’d be interested in knowing what a sensitive, compassionate soul she is and how she supports her lowlife, brother the killer. Such a classy family and terrible sore LOSERS
Did you check out her friends list?
https://www.facebook.com/justicefor.manuel
Ever been to El Centro? It’s the asshole of California.
Whatever it is that they are serving in El Centro must really stink. Did anyone hear about the MWD Director that whips his stepson for not being “man enough” to catch a baseball?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVQVBJgVxyM
I saw it on the news last night. He was literally whipping the poor boy with a belt. It was horrible and so heartbreaking. Thank goodness the neighbor recorded it. He has a public position of some sort.
Oops…FL mentioned his public position.
Those links don’t seem to be working…neither Jill Cicinelli’s page, nor the “justice for manuel” one.
When I try to click on the links, I get an error message from Facebook saying that the page is unavailable.
I was just able to open all three of the links, no problem.
I’m using Firefox – not sure if that matters.
As of right now (2:33 P.M.), under Jill’s interests, she has listed…..
Clorox
Eww.
page not found
Chris,
Facebook spazes out and does that every once and awhile. You just have to try again later or hit refresh until it comes up.
There’s nothing much to see. They don’t post anything.
Justice for Manuel has three subscribers. Ha! I wonder if their names are Bankhead, Jones and McKinley.
REALLY REALLY BAD, To suffer is to know, and the truth will…?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Gangs in Blue is a hood video with heart. It documents the offensive actions of criminal cops. Interviews, footage and newsreel
http://www.copwatchla.org/newsaction.cgi?article=—968453221.98906560636.00968453221.98906560636
When Help or Police are seriously avoided hell will soon follow.
Hey, Champion Master, I like the video “Gangs in Blue”, but some of those brothers in Philly need to remember that oppression is universal and so is the desire for freedom! White people are suffering under white cops, and black cops, too! This is about all of us, together, and that’s the only way we can make it and survive, because we can see the future’s getting tougher. There’s got to be some trust between us, or it’ll just get worser, faster, longer. We all just want to love life and live life and take care of our families, and get along, but we’ve got to try.
Thanks Kelly, where should I return the silver platter?
To the author of a Letter to Kelly: My appreciation and gratitude to you for your compassion towards a mentally handicapped person. My 29-year-old son Aron has claustrophobia and schizophrenia, and was noncompliant for psych meds. He was sleeping on the ground by choice for three years. Also, my appreciation and gratitude to the residents of Fullerton who have taken action to protect vulnerable people in Fullerton.
To Elaine P:
I truly hope your son’s condition has improved and is now compliant with his meds.
I just had to admit my son as he decided to dump out his psych meds.
best wishes
To Wrong Guy: Aron was 5150/5250/5270’d after walking in traffic. After being confined in a locked facility he was transferred to an unlocked board and care. He currently is compliant with his psych meds and with the rules at the board and care. He apparently is motivated by his fear of returning to a locked facility. This is after THREE YEARS of him sleeping on the ground. It is difficult for people to understand how hard it is to control someone like this unless they’ve suffered through this. Good luck with your son.
Did anyone else see that Jill Cicinelli is friends with Ramos’ wife? She looks like a butch. I wonder if these people bonded after being murderers together or if they were already this close, then Cicinelli’s involvement that night would be more suspicious.
I am sorely tempted to say some pretty bad things, just an honest piece of my mind to anyone who would defend a man who demands documentation and care for an elbow scrape while another man lies drowning in his own blood. I think that speaks for itself, and loudly so.
ripening fall
@ ARGH: If you managed to contain your rage long enough to actually read my post you’d see I was not defending Cicinelli. I was trying to get an answer from his supporters as to why they did not seek counseling for him. Everyone has the right to fight hatred and ignorance with more hatred and ignorance. Good luck with that.
@ John: I too have a problem with self-righteous hypocrites like Lisa. That is why I was trying to get her to admit that she and her family failed to get Cicinelli the help he needed to prevent him from acting out on his rage. And I am also disappointed by the fact he is facing such weak charges. I think if we compare the charges the men who beat Bryan Stow get, and he was only beat for a fraction of the time and is still alive, we will see the double standard that favors cops when it comes to abusing innocent citizens.
True enough, Brandon. They’re truly outting themselves with their comments. They come here with their ugliness to spread more hatred and lies. If they’re so convinced they are in the right they wouldn’t be so defensive and putrid. Trash talking the victim just proves their intent and guilt.
I have been in contact with Friends For Jay and they deny that the Lisa above is a family member nor associated with Friends For Jay.
I think they truly believe Kelly Thomas got what he deserved Spanooch. Or at the very least think a cop has a right to beat someone mercilessly if the person does not obey the cops’ orders, however uncalled for and provoking the orders were. I’m sure deep down they know they’re wrong, but on the surface I’m not so sure.
I agree, Brandon, they’re so full of themselves they deem themselves judge & jury and give themselves the God given right to take a life. Kelly was an inconvenience to them and they saw him as unworthy. They’re finding out how wrong they were/are. You have to be pretty heartless and dead inside to kill someone while they’re crying out for help and screaming in pain.
I’m grateful for the video and audio and that it’s been made public. Now we are their judge and jury and they can’t bully themselves out of this one.
Heartless and Joyful Glee are two different things.
Admin : Is anyone aware and listening to KFI’s special report ( going on right now on Bill Carroll’s show ) presenting info in defense of the officier’s choices and questioning the interpretation of the video tape? Folks… We need to be listening to this.
Jay Cicinelli’s “Sister” is not helping his cause. I notice on here that little is said of Ramos. He has 5 kids to feed. They cut off his pay. Jay is still getting his $48,000 per year tax free disability pension from his LAPD days. No such financial worries for him. However, his “sister” makes comments that are basically pathetic. This of course, riles the folks on this blog and it filters to city council who represent the City of Fullerton. The day will come when Cicinelli will wish his “sister” just shut up and the wrath of the City is upon Ramos who is facing the murder charges! So its time Jay’s “sister” crawl into a hole for the next year or so. Believe me, its excellent advice!
As I stated above, Friends For Jay has denied that hte person we assumed was Jay’s sister has any relation to them at all. Lisa could be a stranger trying to insinutate a false identity to hyperbolize police thinking. Then again, I could be mislead and Lisa is truely Jay’s sister and speaking of the thinking of Jay.
Let us use our investigative discernment and together discover what is the truth.
I couldn’t have put it better myself Spanooch. While I know the ultimate blame lies on the officers who chose to act like criminals, the system that allows them to harass people based on ethnicity, socioeconomic status, mental ability, etc., is partly to blame as well.
I hope you are right about them not escaping justice, but I fear they will get reduced charges, if any.
I need to find a good woman like Mrs. Jay. My wife gets pissed at me if I drop the “c” word in mixed company. While there are others that seem to approve of their man relentlessly hammering an already unconscious skinny man over, and over, and over, and over again, (x 3) in the face with both ends of a taser. Hard day at the office honey? I will give Jay credit for one thing though, as it appears that he accidentally tasered Hampton doing his rage storm. I think of it as the one second during the 45 minute murder, that was justified. I will also conclude that Jay is a racist. Why not?
My impression (what I remember of the video) was a real coward, beating Kelly Thomas in the face with a tazer, from behind Kelly’s back. That’s a coward, in my book, beating a helpless, downed man, and from behind his back. Then, this coward blurts out some pathetic half-apology in a tone and language to me which sounded like someone with a very, very low-IQ, saying something to the effect of, “Doh.. I think I may have hit him too many times with the tazer and broke his face” (paraphrased). When I heard that, I just thought to myself, “My God, what a dumb-ass cretan this pathetic excuse for a human being is, to blurt out something stupid like that after pounding someone’s face to a pulp”. My honest impression was that this man must be a complete idiot.