Preliminary Hearing In Thomas Killing Today


After being postponed twice the Preliminary Hearing in the case against Fullerton cops Manny Ramos and jay Cicinelli for the killing of homeless schizophrenic Kelly Thomas last July. Ten months have elapsed since that hot, fateful night.

Ramos is charged with second degree murder; Cicinelli with manslaughter.

The purpose of the hearing is for a judge to view evidence presented by the District Attorney and decide whether the charged should be bound over for trial.

All sorts of questions will be answered in the next day or two: will the DAs original charges fold as some have predicted? Will a cop-cozy judge say Ramos and Cicinelli were just doing their jobs? On the political side, how will more media exposure effect the Recall of the Three Bald Tires, occurring as it will with the delivery of absentee ballots?

For those who can make it, the hearing will take place this morning at 8:30 in Courtroom C1 in the Superior Court building, in downtown Santa Ana.

 

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  1. #1 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

    I would be very much surprised if it happens, but If the DA’s case folds like a bad hand at a card game, I suppose the next step will be a federal civil rights case brought forth by the FBI. I don’t see how the defense can slither out of the compelling evidence contained within the video!

  2. #2 by Nonya B on May 7, 2012

    CH 4 news is still (ignorantly) calling it an “altercation” on the news this morning. Makes me sad that the media still making this out as Kelly Thomas having committed assault against the cops. My thoughts will be with the Thomas family today.

  3. #3 by Tom Hanson on May 7, 2012

    Channel 2 mentioned that Thomas failed to comply. It’s hard to comply when your being beaten to death.

    • #4 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

      He calls the officers sir as he tries to explain he can’t put his other hand behind his back because of how they locked him on the ground. Pretty fucking compliant while he is being beaten to death.

  4. #5 by Bearded Intellectual on May 7, 2012

    Last night Ron Thomas went on KTLA and said that the video will be released to the public today. I believe he also said that officer Joe Wolfe will be charged.

  5. #9 by Fred Alcazar on May 7, 2012

    This will be an interesting day for some of us who have believed from the beginning that the case was designed to fail. That:

    1. The murder charge against Ramos was unsustainable;

    2. That the unbelievable tale told by the DA about Wolfe exonerated him;

    3. That the facial attack by Cicinelli didn’t get a more serious charge – and a higher bail;

    4. That The DA investigators had no interest in the handling of the synchronized reports by FPD bosses;

    5. That nobody seemed too interested in the likelihood of an orchestrated attack on Thomas in the first place.

    Build a small house of cards then shrug when it gets blown over. I have zero confidence in the DA.

    • #10 by apathy on May 7, 2012

      many are involved in the coverup. http://s10.postimage.org/vg013y1mh/coverup.png

      • #11 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

        Who are those guys?

        • #12 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

          Oh never mind….Michael Gennaco. Sheesh…my brain isn’t working this morning.

        • #13 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

          And I agree they are in on the coverup…absolutely.

      • #14 by Friendly Neighbor on May 7, 2012

        Hey! Wait a cotton pickin’ minute. I’m in that picture.

    • #15 by apathy on May 7, 2012

      Why wasn’t Wolfe’s recorder or any of the other officers digital recorders used but only Ramos’s recorder?Might it show thier involvement?
      LA Times-“Much of the evidence came from a recording device attached to Ramos’ uniform, which all Fullerton officers wear.”

  6. #16 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

    Once the video is released to the public what will happen? Does that mean media outlets or private citizens can request and / or distribute it?

  7. #17 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    I believe that there were already some major strategical errors by the DA in prosecuting this case that will play into the favor of the cops. Once we see the video all our questions will be answerered. The camera doesn’t lie. I believe the gut reactions of the actual witnesses as they were caught on the bus video only minutes after the bludgeoning. And I believe far more than 2 should be facing charges. And I believe the actual level of charges lodged against Cicinelli and Ramos were backwards, meaning that Cicinelli should have been charged with 2nd degree and involuntary or voluntary manslaughter against Ramos. Now let’s sit back and watch the show.

    • #18 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

      I agree with almost, if not, every point you posted above. Now that the moment has arrived and the gravity of the situation is still hitting me, I wonder if I’ve been a little too critical. Do I think that more officers be charged with harsher crimes? Yes, I do. However, I keep reading this one line that states this is the first time in CA history that charges like these have been brought against on-duty officers in uniform. I don’t know law specifics, I have only the general impression that change happens in increments. Perhaps these were the charges most likely to be successful? Ron Thomas did say in an interview that the DA is still considering charges against Wolfe. Perhaps if this trial goes well then we might possibly see more action on the part of the DA? I do think that T-Rack would (will) be committing career suicide if he botched it on purpose.

      • #19 by Joe Sipowicz on May 7, 2012

        “I do think that T-Rack would (will) be committing career suicide if he botched it on purpose.”

        I would agree if he had any opposition when he runs. He doesn’t.

        • #20 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

          That’s disheartening but true. FFFF has done such an excellent job concerning the recall and cleaning up the city council, perhaps “they” could drum up some alternatives or competition for the DA position?

      • #21 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

        I don’t think justice should happen in ‘increments’, Concerned Texan. Especially justice for those who have historically purported to be held to a ‘higher standard’. Allowing the other cops to skate is just another indication of how sick our society is and how rotted the head of the fish has become. We should not have to negotiate to defer filing charges against some cops because historically we have not charged them at all. If you buy into that notion then you are buying into the corruption and filth. ZERO TOLERANCE. That is the ONLY honorable way to deal with this case.

        • #22 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

          I appreciate your point of view, but I think your logic is a little off. I believe that we should not have to negotiate or defer filings, philosophically I agree with zero tolerance. I have said from the start that I want all the officers charged and convicted, period.

          I also at some point have to accept how the legal systems works at this moment in time but that doesn’t meant I buy into corruption and filth. I feel like you substituted “legal system” or law with the word “justice.” I want justice, and I believe the DA should do a lot more. Sometimes I think those two concepts are contradictory.

          • #23 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

            Concerned Texan, the legal system is OBLIGATED to represent justice for all. Because it falls short of that you think we should compromise and accept what it throws at us as long as it tosses in a few crumbs or bones at the same time? Sorry, I promote higher standards than that, particularly for those who have been given the authority to make judgment calls in the field that result in someone’s freedom being take away or someone losing their life. That is why they are supposed be judged by a ‘higher standard’ in their own words. If we compromise – we lose. That is how the slippery slope began in the first place. ZERO TOLERANCE is the ONLY answer.

  8. #24 by Reality Is on May 7, 2012

    Exciting. May the first stage of justice prevail.

  9. #25 by Observer of Fullerton on May 7, 2012

    Isn’t it odd that we havent heard much from Ron since he viewed the tape? My guess is even if they are held over for trial, there is no way these two get convicted.

    • #26 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

      I’ve heard a lot from Ron. I’ve seen many video’s from Kelly’s Army many of which were posted here. You can go to youtube and search for them as well. I’ve actually watched three videos featuring Ron in the past 2 hours. I am praying for him today. It’s funny, I suppose if you didn’t want to hear from Ron it would be easy for you to ignore everything that is out there.

    • #27 by Johnny Donut on May 7, 2012

      Ron Thomas was viewing evidence under seal. He couldn’t say much per the court and his agreement with the DA.

  10. #28 by Johnny Donut on May 7, 2012

    Lou Ponsi is twitting that the video will likely be shown in court after lunch today.

    http://twitter.com/louponsi

    • #29 by Bird. It's the Word. on June 30, 2012

      Good move by the court staff. Except cops, who would have been able to eat lunch after seeing that?

  11. #30 by Jane H on May 7, 2012

    I wish I were there.
    _________________________________________________

    Lou Ponsi

    Witness lineup: 1. CSI investigator 2 paramedic 3 FPD Sgt. 4 VIDEO 5 UCI surgeon

    Lou Ponsi ‏ @louponsi

    Thomas prelim: video likely shown after lunch

  12. #31 by truthseeker on May 7, 2012

    Many precedents being set here. I personally believe that there were so many wild cards dealt in a panic by the establishment that created a haphazard culmination of events here has led to where we are. This was such a unique event-massive public outrage, witnesses, video footage, and a global media circus created a perfect storm which made a conventional cover-up impossible. However to think that it has come to this shows that there is still tremendous power vested in the people. They can only “kick against the pricks” for so long. I for one am optimistic that justice will be served. We are not a third world country yet and it is NOT acceptable for the agents of the state to summarily execute citizens in the street. I pray that law enforcement nationally pays heed to the ramifications of this kind of conduct in this new virtual digital age. The cameras are rolling on US ALL.

  13. #32 by van get it da artiste on May 7, 2012

    If not for bedroom city commando, long-time Fullerton police chief Pat McKinley’s leadership, these fullerton police officers would not be in the hot mess they are in now.
    Though Cicinelli, Ramos, Wolfe are responsible for the murder of kelly thomas, it is Mckinley’s policing philosophy of us versus them that is the proximate cause of thomas’ death.
    the tacit approval of fullerton’s city council of McKinley’s leadership when he was police chief from 1993 to 2009 also makes them responsible for Thomas’ death.
    Fullerton city council person Jones public comments that downtown was an out of control wild west explains why Jones et al hired Commando McKinley and allowed him turn FPD from a peace keeping force into special ops

    • #33 by Joe Sipowicz on May 7, 2012

      No, it was Special Ops without the physical or professional training. Bad attitude and bad physical conditioning led to Kelly’s killing.

  14. #34 by Vernon Dozier on May 7, 2012

    Lou Ponsi has good updates flowing in from the courtroom.

    http://twitter.com/louponsi

  15. #35 by One for the books on May 7, 2012

    No one will ever convince me that it takes 6 guys to subdue an unarmed, 140 pound undernourished drifter and handcuff him!

    • #36 by Bird. It's the Word. on June 30, 2012

      Indeed. And not forgetting that out of the 7 involved in the “scuffle”, the one being subdued is the one who weighed the least…and by a far margin.

  16. #37 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Google News “Real Time Updates”
    Preliminary hearing Kelly Thomas, FPD Officers.

    TEST
    https://news.google.com/news/rtc?pz=1&cf=all&ncl=d4oqszb-tZNiVsMIwrxfPQj-v3cKM

    • #38 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

      Thank you for the link. Now I can see how much of a pro-cop spin Ponsi is putting into his tweets. Compare his tweets with the first article and the difference is night and day.

  17. #40 by peaches on May 7, 2012

    CSI testified (during cross exam) that Ramos said “that was the fight of my life” – I’m thinking the defense wants to use that to bolster its case, but it can also be taken as enjoyment on Ramos’ part…

    Good to see that hard-hitting reporter Ponsi is on the job

    • #41 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

      I cringe when I hear the acronym “CSI”

  18. #42 by Never met Ramos on May 7, 2012

    I just watched the story on NBC, waiting for the channel 5 news at 1:00 and they showed the leg of Ramos, after showing his elbow “injury” omg he is huge. If this man had any trouble “fighting off” Kelly, I will eat my left foot. Amazing how the lies flow from the FPD cops…sad.

  19. #43 by Reality Is on May 7, 2012

    Courtroom is awesome. Exciting. Trial will be nuts.

  20. #44 by Jt on May 7, 2012

    “Dying Kelly Thomas Initially Ignored By Fullerton Paramedics”

    http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2012/05/kelly_thomas_fullerton_police_4.php

  21. #45 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Kelly Thomas, 37, was hospitalized July 5 after an altercation with six Fullerton police officers at a bus depot. He died five days later after he was removed from life support.

    The FBI and Orange County District Attorney are investigating the case.

    A timeline of events in the case is listed below. Click on the articles and videos details.

    July 5: Kelly Thomas, 37, is hospitalized after an altercation with six Fullerton police officers at a bus depot. Police were called to the location to investigate a report of a vehicle break-in.

    July 10: After five days on life support, Kelly Thomas is pronounced dead.

    July 23: Cellphone video of the altercation is posted online. It is difficult to see the events on video, but Thomas can be heard crying out for help.

    July 28: The Orange County District Attorney’s office calls on witnesses to provide information in the case. Article

    July 30: Hundreds of protesters gather at the Fullerton Police Department. Article

    Aug. 1: Video from a bus camera shows passengers describing the altercation as they board. Article/Video

    Aug. 2: Ron Thomas speaks at a Fullerton City Council meeting, imploring officials to listen to the audio recorded during the altercation. Article/Video

    Aug. 2: The six officers involved in the case are placed on paid administrative leave.

    Aug. 3: A Fullerton councilmember asks for the police chief’s resignation. Article

    Aug. 5: The American Civil Liberties Union issues a statement expressing doubt in the Orange County DA’s ability to properly handle of the case. The DA’s office responds by saying “The ACLU is incapable of not grandstanding.” Article

    Aug. 5: Another city council member calls for the police chief’s resignation. Video

    Aug. 6: Hundreds joined Ron Thomas at a rally at the Fullerton Police Department. Article/Video

    Aug. 9: The office of Orange County District Attorney Tony Rackauckas told NBC4 there is no evidence to show the officers intended to kill Kelly Thomas, but they are still trying to determine if officers used excessive force in his death. Article

    Aug. 10: In a news release from the city, officials announce that Police Chief Sellers will take a medical leave. Capt. Kevin Hamilton is appointed interim chief. Article/Video

    Aug. 11: The parents of Kelly Thomas file a claim against the city, a precursor to a lawsuit. Article

    Aug. 12: City council members meet to discuss an independent review of the case. The city attorney is directed to draft a contract for services. Article

    Aug 12: An LA Times report reveals that Fullerton officers were allowed to view video of the altercation before writing their reports. Article

    Aug. 12: Fullerton residents file papers to start the recall process against three city officials. Article

    Aug. 12: Kelly Thomas’ father conducts a news conference at which he discusses his meeting with the District Attorney. Article

    Aug. 16: Ron Thomas and Fullerton residents speak at a meeting at which the council approved a contract with an independent investigator. Article

    Aug. 17: Ron Thomas and Fullerton’s mayor, Richard Jones, meet to discuss the case. Jones issues a statement later in the day to say he is not resigning. Article

    Sept. 21: The district attorney announces charges against two officers in connection with the beating death. Article

    Sept. 29: Manuel Ramos, charged with second-degree murder in Thomas’ beating death, post bail and is released from jail. Article

    Sept. 29: Officers charged in Kelly Thomas Case placed on unpaid administrative leave. Article

    Oct. 5: Medical leave extended for Fullerton Police Chief Michael Sellers. Article

    Oct. 20: Fullerton Homeless Task Force is created as a result of the Kelly Thomas case. Article

    Nov. 4: Both officers accused in the case plead not guilty at a hearing attended by Ron Thomas. Article

    Nov. 20: LA Times reports Fullerton officer Jay Cicinelli continues to receive his nearly $40,000 annual disability pension. Article

    Dec. 16: Pre-trial hearing for two officers charged in the Kelly Thomas case. Article

    Dec. 21: Dan Hughes is named as the new chief of Fullerton Police Department. Article

    Dec. 21: Ron Thomas disapproved of the appointment of new police chief. Article

    Feb. 3: Former Chief Michael Sellers announces his retirement, effective Feb. 18. He was awared with $150,000 stemming from a workers’ compensation claim. Article

    May 7, 2012: A preliminary hearing begins in the cases against Cicinelli and Ramos. Article

  22. #46 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Court video and evidence photos in court, court photos and Ron Thomas Interview (warning graphic)

    http://www.myfoxla.com/dpp/news/local/preliminary-hearing-testimony-for-fullerton-pd-officers-charged-in-kelly-thomas-beating-2012-05-07

    • #47 by Reality Is on May 7, 2012

      So intense. Testified 100’s of times in court on death penalty cases and everything else. Never seen anything like this. I can’t sit still. This courtroom is nuts. Staring. Still think prelim is a formality but trial will be crazy.

      • #48 by Johnny Donut on May 7, 2012

        You’re not anywhere near that courtroom, you liar.

      • #49 by Casually Observing on May 7, 2012

        Hey RI, is the courtroom packed with out-of-work FFFF bloggers?

        • #50 by truthseeker on May 7, 2012

          Its packed with petrified establishment lackeys and also with people with a soul that has not been sold to Lucifer.

          • #51 by truthseeker on May 7, 2012

            forgive the capital L as it should be lowercase

        • #52 by Reality Is on May 7, 2012

          Donut? Look left 3rd row.

          Yea a good mix actually. Not just out of work FFFf bloggers or activists. Media. Good solid mix. Supporters too.

          Good times.

  23. #53 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

    Does Dawn Scruggs have a bad track record with the FPD? I’m disgusted that the “officers” pulled aside medics for assistance and not even mention that Kelly was dying just a few feet away. I am just so disgusted.

    • #54 by Vernon Dozier on May 7, 2012

      No.

    • #55 by Jt on May 7, 2012

      We have culture in which police are “heroes” and thus their lives are thought to be worth more than that of the citizenry they are sworn to protect.

      I’ve never understand this. If you get paid to do a job which is dangerous and you are killed or injured in the course of duty, while unfortunate, that comes with the territory and your life should be considered to be worth less than an innocent bystander. A civilian’s life should be worth more than a soldier’s in war, and a civilian’s life should be worth more than a cop’s life in general. Why? Because soldiers choose to fight, and cops choose to enforce the law. Civilian victims have made no such choice and don’t get paid for the violence meted out to them.

      • #56 by Reality Is on May 7, 2012

        Understood by the majority though. Killed protecting the citizens. Yes paid. Soldiers are paid too. Cops aren’t heros, firemen are. Why? See? Just the way it is. Respect I think. A window washer dies and the windows can’t pay respect. An oil man dies the oil can’t pay respect. Employers do I’m sure. Cop protecting the city people so they pay respect. Large amounts of state and federal money for the families too. Fireman same thing. The people pay respect. I think about respect and not what you see, that cops are garbage. You are biased.

        Onto the prelim. Let’s get it on.

      • #62 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

        Yes, Jt. Good point.

        But the system stands behind the principle that their safety and their lives are more valuable than that of the common ordinary citizen.

        Take, for example, if the cops illegally rough somebody up and are found liable for assault under the color of authority in Federal court. Does the department ever apologize to the victim citizen – even after the case is fully adjudicated and settled? Of course not. Yet if a common citizen is charged with assault on a cop – if he doesn’t publicly apologize to the cop chances are he will pay for it with a couple extra years in jail. That’s the way the system is set up, Jt. Is it right? Of course not. But what is …..IS. And that really can’t be denied by anyone who is knowledgable on the subject.

    • #63 by Fullerton Lover on May 7, 2012

      She did give the defendant’s a look like “how’d I do?” when she left the witness stand.

  24. #69 by Longtimefullertongirl on May 7, 2012

    I wish I was there also, please provide an update of what happened this morning, and what is to happen next (in plenty of time for all of us to be there).

    • #70 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

      fullertonsfuture should ask someone to volunteer to liveblog this case. I would do it if I lived in that area.

  25. #71 by One for the books on May 7, 2012

    WOW!!!! Paramedics were directed by Fullerton P.D. to tend to the minor scrapes on officers hands and arms before tending to the dying kelly?!?!?!?!?!

    • #72 by Fullerton Lover on May 7, 2012

      Testimony I heard today from Fire Captain Stansyck(?) 28 year veteran of FFD, was that he was responding to a “person down” with police involvement. He parked his truck behind the patrol cars, and asked, “what do you have”? I didn’t hear if he gave the Officer’s response, however I did hear him say that he tended to officers “lacerations” (scrapes) with a alcohol swipe/towelette.
      He said that it was while he was tending to the last officer’s boo-boo’s is when he noticed Kelly laying on his side, leaning against another officer while still handcuffed. He stated Kelly was ashen color, and his breathing was very slow.
      I honestly was sickened by this Captain’s testimony because I’ve always thought of Paramedics as extremely compassionate people. Not this one.

      • #73 by mala sangre on July 8, 2012

        thats not how you become a captain though

        • #74 by Fullerton Lover on July 8, 2012

          Unfortunately mala sangre, that’s EXACTLY how you become a Captain in the “you cover my back, I’ll cover yours” culture that currently exists within the public safety officers “brotherhood” here in Fullerton.

  26. #75 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    They wanted him to die (OBVIOUS), according to FFFF Comment of pissed EMT, Ambulance wasnt allowed to leave, told to wait for Sargeant, for RTazer incident reporting, Ambulance left on their own.

  27. #77 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    Holy Abraham! Those cops were totally out of control. Kelly’s face looked like raw hamburger and the poor guy could hardly breath. So the cops ordered the paramedics to tend to the scrapes on their hands probably caused by bludgeoning Kelly’s skull? If true that is lower than whale poop and all of them should be thrown into the general population at Rikers.

  28. #78 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

    Lou Ponsi must be too busy to get his handkerchief ready because he’s too busy tweeting about his fabulous beef noodle soup. He is so off-putting.

    • #79 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

      that is the nicest way of putting it, CT. In our house he is know as a the Register’s gigantic A-hole.

      • #80 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

        It shows. It really really shows. That man does not need a twitter account.

    • #81 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

      What an assclown!

    • #82 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

      That’s probably why his last name is ‘Ponsi’.

    • #83 by truthseeker on May 7, 2012

      In all the midst of this deception and gruesomeness of this tragedy the Ponzi scheme is worried about his microwaved dioxin leaching styrofoam hydrolized protein excitotoxin laden lunch. Poor soul. Maybe he is one of those who have sold it for the 30 pieces of silver. This prelim is all about a brutal murder and he acts like he is kid at the movies.

  29. #84 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

    Right? I was thinking the same thing. Glad he had a good lunch.

  30. #85 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

    Fullerton stories just tweeted that they have the video and are posting ASAP

    • #86 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

      Not JUST tweeted, but 45 min ago.

      • #87 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

        Do you have a link? How did Fullerton Stories get it so quickly?

  31. #88 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    tune into KFI

  32. #89 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    listening to the audio on KFI is making me sickl

  33. #92 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    they are editing audio now for cuzz words. will resume shortly

  34. #94 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

    I sobbed all the way home from work, listening to the audio KFI just played. HORRIBLE, AWFUL, Fing murderers.

    • #95 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

      I’m listening now and it’s just pure commercials. Is it over? Will they replay it?

  35. #96 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    back on

  36. #97 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    I’m listening to Kelly being repeatedly tased by these f…ing animals. Good God. He’s screaming and gurgling on his own blood!!! I am almost in tears!!! How could this happen in the United States of America???? I grieve.

  37. #98 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    this is fucking horrific.

  38. #99 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    I don’t even need to see video after hearing that.
    pure evil.

  39. #100 by Tracey on May 7, 2012

    This is absolutely worst thing I have ever heard in my life. If I had to hear my child scream for me like that, I don’t think I would still be alive today.

    My heart truly goes out to the Thomas family.

    I just heard probably 2-3 minutes and I am horrified and deeply disturbed. I do think I can watch the video when it comes out. It would be too much for me.

  40. #101 by Just heard the audio on May 7, 2012

    FUCK YOU BILL CAROL & FUCK YOU WEENIE KFI REPORTERS TRYING TO WHITE WASH THIS!

    DISGUSTING!!!!!!!!

    • #102 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

      I have to agree with your sentiments on that one.

    • #103 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

      I agree.

  41. #104 by merijoe on May 7, 2012

    OMG-OMG very hard to hear-in tears now, that poor man.

  42. #105 by Tracey on May 7, 2012

    I meant to say I DO NOT think I can watch the video.

  43. #106 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    Bill Carroll is an idiot

  44. #107 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    Expect the mainstream media to support the cops. They depend on the cops for their stories. Let’s wait and hear what John & Ken say. Maybe they will flip flop too. That KFI reporter Gregory depends on the cops for breaking news and stories. Do you think he is going to trash talk the cops????

  45. #108 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    I will watch the video only because I need to know the truth and I need to see it with my own eyes. But it will be painful. It’s no fun watching a man get brutally beaten to death by savages.

  46. #109 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    If John and Ken bend over like Bill Carroll just did, I am done with their show.

  47. #111 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Just heard the audio :
    FUCK YOU BILL CAROL & FUCK YOU WEENIE KFI REPORTERS TRYING TO WHITE WASH THIS!
    DISGUSTING!!!!!!!!

    They were a bit snifferish, brainwashed by ride alongs and meetings with FPD. (like some here) something tells me they will do some research and realize the McSatan hierarchy.

    They aint got nothing on Sadahm, Uday and Kusey, this is a civilized Country last I checked!

  48. #113 by One for the books on May 7, 2012

    Bill Carroll just rambles!!!

  49. #114 by fullertongirl65 on May 7, 2012

    Ken Chiampo (sp? “Kelly’s FANS”??????

    • #115 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

      Just heard that. fuck him.

      • #116 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

        Thank god Ken was on vacation when John covered it.

        • #117 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

          I should say the first time John covered it back in 2011.

    • #118 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

      yeah WTF was that

    • #119 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

      I caught that too…. and the implication that Kelly’s “fans” just want a guilty verdict.

  50. #120 by One for the books on May 7, 2012

    I would LOOOOOOOOVE to be on that radio show right now!!!

  51. #122 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Witness testimony on video and official statements will be severely damning!

  52. #123 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    What sort of country have we turned into? Now the media will look for any crack in the armour to support the cops. Why? Because they work together. The cops make the news and the media reports it. We’ve seen it with Kelly and with Manny Loggins – the marine who was gunned down in the front seat by the cops while his 2 little girls watched him get blown away from the back seat in San Clemente. When are they going to start wearing lightening bolts on their shirts???

  53. #125 by SherBear on May 7, 2012

    Ch 9 just showed a small clip of the CCTV footage. It was heartwrenching and sickening. I’ve always said I didn’t want to view it but I couldn’t turn away. The narrated the part where Kelly keeps saying he’s sorry but I believe I could also hear Kelly saying he couldn’t breathe.

    • #126 by peaches on May 7, 2012

      I saw that also; Kelly Thomas was down and didn’t seem to be moving much, if at all (and I think that was with “only” 2 of them whaling at him).

      “Feeding frenzy” comes to mind

  54. #127 by Anonymous on May 7, 2012

    They’re playing it again now!

    http://www.iheart.com/#/live/177/?autoplay=true

  55. #128 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

    Wow, one of them just said, if his hands aren’t behind his back, he’s resisting, …. yeah, he’s resisting. SERIOUSLY?!?!?!?!?!? If the officers are pinning him down then he CAN’T give them his hands.

  56. #129 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    Kelly is repeatedly saying “I’m sorry, I’m sorry” 20 seconds into the tape. He’s saying “I can’t breath, I can’t breath” Obviously he’s trying to comply. But they won’t let up. And that’s when the beating really starts!!! OMG!!!! They are killing him!!!! OMG!!!!

    • #130 by Justice for ALL on May 8, 2012

      Yes, the “reality is” that Kelly Thomas was brutally tortured and murdered by members of the Fullerton Police Dept. Many witnesses have known this sickening fact since last July 5, 2011.

    • #131 by mala sangre on July 8, 2012

      thats the bully way. the more you beg the more fun it is

  57. #132 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    “It was the fight of his life- RAMOS”

  58. #133 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    Now they are tasering him over and over again!!! What aholes!!! SIX COPS TOO on top of a 130 pound man!!!

    THAT IS MURDER. NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. I DON’T NEED TO HEAR ANY MORE!!!

    GUILTY!!!!! ON ALL COUNTS!!!!!!

  59. #134 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    Now he’s saying “Help me, dad”

    I’m in tears.

  60. #135 by Durfee on May 7, 2012

    Just heard the audio of the beating on KFI. Those cops are sadists that belong in jail.

  61. #136 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Remember they are acting for their DAR audio recorders on their belt, they might have known there was a hi res video camera there, but they didnt think it would get out or even be used.

  62. #139 by Concerned Texan on May 7, 2012

    The whole situation is live action embodiment of biblical evil.

  63. #141 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    This is the kind of brutality and evil behavior that I heard took place at the hands of the Nazi storm troopers on Kristal Nacht. How could this happen in the United States of America? WIth liberty and justice for all?

  64. #142 by give me liberty or DEATH on May 7, 2012

    Mon. 5/07/2012
    Fullerton lying, falsifying, fabricating, armed, unionized, drug-crazed, dirty cop terrorists with “police powers” killing Kelly Thomas for absolutely NOTHING !!!!! snuff video and audio of killing by dirty cop terrorists with “police powers.”

  65. #143 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Now we know why they waited till just after the Rodney King 20 year anniversary.

  66. #144 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    Thank you, John Kobeylt, for sticking up for Kelly and trash talking the cops. Sounds like Ken Chiampou is looking for an opening to support the cops tho. The good guy – bad guy routine. There was no gray area here. Kelly made it crystal clear that he gave up early in the fight. But the cops couldn’t care less. The more he screamed for mercy the harder they beat and tased him. Preposterous!

  67. #145 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    @FFFF Please contact Dr Ott for a follow up.

  68. #146 by merijoe on May 7, 2012

    I can’t understand how anyone who watched this video-ie the cicinelli stepdad and sister could make nasty remarks about how their Jay was so wonderful and he did nothing wrong.

    Or how Ramos could say this was a “fight of his life”- he did all the fighting to Kelly.

    Ramos looked exhausted? per the CSI person? yeah cause he had to run for the first time in years

    • #147 by karma on May 7, 2012

      “yeah cause he had to run for the first time in years”

      no shit,he probably called the ambulance for himself thinking he was having a heart attack.

  69. #148 by NotSoRedDawn on May 7, 2012

    FPD wants to put the blame of Kelly Thomas’ death on the Fire Dept? Do they really think people are that stupid?

  70. #150 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

    Out of breath, like a thrill killer, for what might be his first time.

    sa·dist  [sey-dist, sad-ist]
    noun
    1.
    Psychiatry . a person who has the condition of sadism, in which one receives sexual gratification from causing pain and degradation to another.
    2.
    a person who enjoys being cruel.

  71. #151 by give me liberty or DEATH on May 7, 2012

    altercation ? confrontation ? no! no! no! it was a vicious killing for no reason by armed, unionized, overtime-abusing, drugged-up dirty cop terrorists with “police powers.” Go peddle your police “tactics” in North Korea, Russia, Turkey, Cuba, Afghanistan, IRAQ, Bahrain, etc.

  72. #152 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    And don’t forget – the entire Fullerton PD gave their total support to the charged cops. Didn’t the department take up contributions for their bail??? Didn’t the Fullerton cops provide security after they bailed??? Who’s paying for their attorney fees? The police union???? And they claim to be the best and the brightest and the moral backbone of society???? Where is Chief Hughes??? Is he going to condemn what we heard and saw today? Or is he going to back the blue??? Which is it??? No more fence walking please!

  73. #154 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

    Why is Lou Ponsi such an assclown?
    “Afternoon break at Kelly Thomas case. Video was rivetting”

    https://twitter.com/#!/louponsi

    • #155 by merijoe on May 7, 2012

      and the beef noodle soup was the best he’s ever had

      • #156 by OCLove on May 7, 2012

        Has anyone ever eaten at that courthouse? It’s nasty ass overpriced food.

    • #157 by Lifesaving Service on May 7, 2012

      Why bother with that fool.

    • #158 by Bird. It's the Word. on June 30, 2012

      Wow. Thanks OCLove.

      I have come to the conclusion that Ponsi is the Paris Hilton of journalism, am I wrong?

  74. #159 by karma on May 7, 2012

    I have never heard anything more horrific in my entire 53 years on this screwed up planet.

    My prediction before I heard this audio (haven’t seen the video yet) would have been that these guys will walk, I don’t think that now. I never really knew evil until I heard the audio of that night. I don’t how there could be a dry eye in the place…(except,of course for Ponsi-scum, who is too busy wondering what the cafeteria has for dinner.)

    I am sick beyond words. I don’t know if I can even watch the video after hearing that.

  75. #160 by give me liberty or DEATH on May 7, 2012

    Headline: Kelly Thomas video: ‘Dad, they are killing me’

    What More is needed to prosecute and execute the two Fullerton dirty cop terrorists with “police powers.” (snuff video and audio courtesy FPD) — the loser: U.S. tax-paying sucker.

  76. #161 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

    Did you happen to see the on-line headlines in the OC Register:

    “Kelly Thomas case: Cop called it ‘fight of my life,’ witness says”

    Imagine that. Empathizing the RAMOS as Kelly was beaten to a bloody pulp and heard speaking his final words while gurgling blood? Amazing. I am really losing faith.

    What did I tell you about the mainstream media showing biased support for the cops??

    Now do you believe me?

  77. #164 by FullertonGirl65 on May 7, 2012

    Fuck the OCR. We cancelled a long time ago.

  78. #165 by SherBear on May 7, 2012

    Ch 7 just showed more of the beginning. How can T-Rack not charge Wolfe? He was in on the beating from the beginning, not after it started and he was merely coming to the aid of a fellow officer. WTF!!

  79. #166 by truthseeker on May 7, 2012

    The Register headline should have read “Dad Dad God God I am sorry I am sorry” This is a total psyop just like the Genacco headline they ran.

    • #167 by merijoe on May 7, 2012

      God, I’m so sad for the Thomas family
      I am still crying- I can’t imagine what a parent would feel seeing and hearing their child tortured and crying out in pain like that and they weren’t able to intervene or help him.

      And poor Kelly.

      • #168 by karma on May 7, 2012

        and it wasn’t like the cops didn’t know who Kelly was and that he had mental issues. he was a known entity.

        I

  80. #169 by NotSoRedDawn on May 7, 2012

    I have heard of a “police brutality epidemic” and it sure looks like an accurate statement once I began to search the internet for reports across the nation.

    Here’s another example from an incident that happened last year. A policeman claimed he shot a man in self-defense. Only problem was that the coroner’s report revealed that the man was shot in the back.
    http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-lapd-shooting-20120507,0,5626899.story

    The death of Kelly Thomas is not only tragic, it’s frightening. Someone in uniform might take a dislike to you for whatever reason, violate your rights, even kill you and be exonerated of all wrongdoings.

    When your civil rights are violated by another citizen you have recourse. What about when your civil rights are violated by government officials and those given authority by the government? How many other victims like Kelly Thomas are out there whose murderers in uniforms will never be brought to justice?

  81. #171 by OCLOVE on May 7, 2012

    89.3 KPCC‏@KPCC

    [email protected] updates from #KellyThomas trial: Doctor asked if struggle with police contributed to Thomas’ loss of oxygen: “Yes”

  82. #172 by WHAT THE HELL on May 7, 2012

    Just saw the video.

    Wolfe hit Kelly first which prompted him to run.

    How is wolfe not charged?

    • #173 by OCLOVE on May 7, 2012

      where is the video?

    • #174 by JustUs on May 7, 2012

      Wolfe must have some bigtime connections in the DA’s office.

      The camera doesn’t lie.

      The DA’s office is suppose to represent the epitome of justice in our society.

      Civilization is in the process of getting flushed!

  83. #175 by OCLove9 on May 7, 2012

    where is the video?

  84. #179 by I'm going to be sick... on May 7, 2012

    “Get on the ground”, “Stop resisting” and “Put your hands behind your back”

    …things that cops commonly say while they’re beating the shit out of detainees.

  85. #180 by Bob from Baltimore on May 7, 2012

    Just saw the video, I can’t even find the right words to say, so sick, I just saw a man murdered.

  86. #181 by give me liberty or DEATH on May 7, 2012

    By Richard Winton l.a. times, Mon May 7 2012 1:45 PM // A fire department captain testified Monday in a hearing, in the beating death of Kelly Thomas that when he first arrived on scene “nothing was being done” to help the mentally ill homeless man. // (and the behavior by the armed, unionized, drug-crazed, overtime-abusing, dirty cop terrorists with “police powers” is mentally healthy ?) Stop labeling, denigrating Kelly Thomas with the term “mentally ill homeless” Homeless does not equal mentally ill, killing innocent people under “police power” authority is MENTALLY ill, you stupid reporter. 7 May, 2012 MONDAY.

  87. #182 by Justice for ALL on May 7, 2012

    I have been grieving deeply for Kelly Thomas and his family ever since I learned the hideous details of his brutal, tortured murder last July 2011.

    What happened to Kelly Thomas is beyond understanding, belief or comprehension by moral people who have a belief in the difference between “right” and “wrong.” What was done to Kelly could only be done by vicious sociopaths or psychopaths who possess no conscience or empathy, or by those who possess no knowledge of the difference between right and wrong and who have no fear of reprisal due to a culture of corruption.

    Nonetheless, Hughes, Hamilton, Gennaco, McKinley and others have certainly seen the photos/tapes/videos, yet they have defended and supported the FPD and the murderers.

    The fact that there are such heartless, soulless men and women in positions of authority in the FPD, within the Fullerton City Council, and within the D.A.’s office, who will willingly cover up such evil, causes me to grieve, and fear, even more deeply.

    May God bless Kelly Thomas and his entire family with peace, comfort and justice. And, may God bless all of us, because we are going to need His help to get rid of all of the evil, self-serving filthy vermin who have, by their actions or by their inactions, allowed Kelly’s murder, and other murders and abuses, to happen under color of authority.

    • #183 by truthseeker on May 7, 2012

      Amen.

    • #184 by merijoe on May 7, 2012

      That made me cry more JFA-God help us all.

      • #185 by Justice for ALL on May 7, 2012

        Merijoe,
        I have been very depressed ever since learning about Kelly’s murder. Kelly was completely innocent and he was mentally ill and very vulnerable. I still can’t comprehend the callousness of Kelly’s murderers.

        My comfort has come from you, -Merijoe, and from MANY other commenters such as Wrong Guy, our beloved FEDUP, ACU, SherBear, to name just a few, and from the wonderful FFFF bloggers. Everyone has worked tirelessly to expose and root out the evil.

        I know that Kelly Thomas is watching from above, and I’m sure that he is grateful. Keep up the good work everyone and say a prayer for strength. The battle for truth and justice will be long and difficult. I send you my love and hugs on this very sad day when we have finally witnessed the true horror that Kelly endured. God Bless Kelly Thomas.

        • #186 by merijoe on May 7, 2012

          JFA-
          I am always depressed to learn of someone or something viciously,and cruelly suffering at the hands of another, especially by someone you are supposed to trust-the only hope that ever comes from such needless pain is that you see people’s compassion and kindness come out – a spirit of helpfulness-sounds Mayberryish, but it’s true-let’s pray that we see good changes come because of the life of Kelly Thomas. We are here to support each other…

          “Most of the important things in the world have been accomplished by people who have kept on trying when there seemed to be no hope at all.”
          Dale Carnegie

          • #187 by merijoe on May 7, 2012

            Oh, almost forgot JFA-thank you for the hugs and love, same for you. Your support and the other’s means alot, especially during these times.

            Yes and special blessings to the Thomas family.

    • #188 by give me liberty or DEATH on May 7, 2012

      Thank you. and Amen.

  88. #189 by jerry on May 7, 2012

    tHE SAD THING KERE IS THAT THIS WILL BE DRAGGED OUT AND SQUASHED.

  89. #190 by Hollis Dugan on May 7, 2012

    Too many comments to read them all. If it hasn’t been said, this is really remarkable timing for the recall. What were the odds that the week absentee ballots come out you would have this story gin national attention again and the video come out for all to see?

    I have a feeling that the situation is going to get worse for the defendants, not better. For example, the fact that the officers demanded treatment for superficial boo boos while a man lay dying in the street is not going to help FPD.

    Stay tuned tomorrow.

  90. #191 by Through different eyes on May 7, 2012

    My husband and I just watched the video;
    Just pitiful, pathetic, and TRULY sickening.

    I do not have words to express my outrage.
    All I can think of is what if that was my son.
    I would not have the strength to go on.

    To the Thomas family,

    I am SO SO sorry.
    I will be praying for JUSTICE for KELLY, he was precious and God loved him, KNOW that. His cries did not fall on deaf ears, God heard him.
    Stay strong and fight the good fight.

    Signed,
    A broken hearted
    and
    ANGRY
    parent.

  91. #192 by rick on May 7, 2012

    who gave the guys a badge? whoever hired these jokers should be demoted. Im so happy I don’t live in this clown of a town. Keep your doors locked windows up and keep driving through. dangerous and a lack of education can only lead to this type of stupidity.

  92. #193 by Survcast on May 8, 2012

    Here is a survey on the video / article that was just released: http://survcast.com/Newly-Released-Surveillance-Video-Shows-Police-Officers-Brutally-Beating-Suffocating-and-Tasing-Kelly-Thomas-to-Death-Hit-Run-Reasoncom

    Please vote your opinion and share it!

  93. #194 by Deborah on May 10, 2012

    They used to hang calttle rustlers and horse thieves….why not all six participants in this murder! It was in plain sight!

  94. #195 by Lifesaving Service on May 10, 2012

    Wrong Year
    Wrong Result
    Wrong Place
    Wrong Message.

  95. #196 by Bond on May 10, 2012

    The Group behind ALL of this is called the Illuminati. Research them! Find out what is GOING DOWN! Wake up and SAVE America!!!!

    • #197 by James on May 10, 2012

      Obama ordered his commie red forces to kill kelly thomas to send a message to the populace. Research communism in America! Joseph McCarthy was right all along!!!!!

      ITS NOT TOO LATE!!!! WAKE UP!!!

  96. #198 by Bird. It's the Word. on June 30, 2012

    Apologies for the vulgarity in advance, but Cicinelli’s glass eye is screaming “How in the fuck does this guy even have a driver’s license?” at me.

    Take a drive with your left eye closed for a few and you’ll see (pun intended) exactly what I am talking about.

(will not be published)