Suicide in Fullerton Jail Should Raise Questions


He checked in, but he din't check out.

Last spring Dean Francis Gochenour, 52, was arrested in Fullerton for suspicion of drunk driving and was taken to the Fullerton jail. He never left. Not alive, anyway.

In the early morning hours of April 15, 2011  Gochenour was discovered in a holding cell, dead. Death by apparent “hanging” was passed out by the cops to the media, although what he was hanging from and by what means wasn’t elaborated. Here’s the brief news clip.

Almost immediately, however, stories began to emanate from the basement of the police HQ to the effect that Gochenour had been demeaned and taunted by the arresting officer; that he had been admonished by the cop to kill himself; that the cop’s behavior had been witnessed and or overheard by a jail employee and reported to his bosses; that a superior had confronted the officer in question, whereupon the latter tried to smash his DAR to destroy evidence; but that said evidence was retrieved.

He was not like you Rotarians. I mean he was not a credible witness. And now he's dead. I guess we could do another one of those "in-house" investigations we excel at.

It would not be entirely out of character for a Fullerton cop to urge an arrestee to commit suicide, given what we’ve seen of the thuggish behavior of our police lately. Is that what happened? Exactly how Gochenour died is not clear. In April it seemed a lot less suspicious than it does now, especially since FPD spokesmen have been shown to play fast and loose with the truth.

All of which begs the questions: who was the cop involved and what is his current employment status? In Fullerton, such things are shrouded behind a nearly impenetrable curtain.

We will try to pull it back and find out.

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  1. #1 by The Fullerton Harpoon on November 22, 2011

    Thanks for reminding us of this.

  2. #2 by fedupwithmorons on November 22, 2011

    What’s next?

  3. #3 by Fred Alcazar on November 22, 2011

    I wonder if Gennaco is going to look into this one, too.

    • #4 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

      He certainly should be!!

    • #5 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

      I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: the Fed’s need to investigate the city and PD from top to bottom! There are too many “irregularities” occurring.

      • #6 by Jt on November 22, 2011

        Here is an excerpt from an email I received this morning:

        ” you haven’t already, you must watch this video of campus police officers at University of California, Davis indiscriminately pepper-spraying protesters while they sit quietly on the ground, as though the officers were simply watering plants.

        Law enforcement has no right to use violence as a tool of torture and punishment against those who do not pose a threat to their safety. This incident is plainly assault and is therefore a criminal violation of our most basic civil rights.

        That’s why we’re calling on the Department of Justice’s Civil Rights Division to investigate the campus police officers involved in the UC Davis pepper-spraying incident and uphold our right to peaceful protest without fear of violent retaliation.

        Sign our petition to the DOJ Civil Rights Division and demand they investigate civil rights violations stemming from the UC Davis pepper-spraying incident.

        Click here to sign: http://action.firedoglake.com/page/s/uc-davis

        Look, if pepper-spraying kids in the face (a stupid and horrible thing to do , no doubt) can result in a petition for a DOJ Civil Rights investigation, then shouldn’t a murder, numerous beatings, an “encouraged suicide”, sexual assaults, and the rest of the crimes committed by Fullerton’s finest thugs?

        I’ve also been saying this for a long time, including to the City Council, we need a DOJ Civil Rights Division Special Investigation of the entire FPD.

        Anybody know when Gennaco’s report is supposed to be concluded?

        • #7 by SherBear on November 22, 2011

          I wonder if that was Goodrich’s sister as the spokesperson for the UC Davis incident. I saw it on KTLA on Sunday evening. They showed Pike pepper spraying the people in such a fashion where he was doing a casual stroll and yes, doing sweeping sprays like he was watering plants. Flash to the spokesperson giving the schpiel on how an officer only has a split second to make a decision when lives are in danger. Then it flashes back to Pike’s leisurely stroll. Maybe it was Mrs Goodrich?

      • #8 by Lucky on November 22, 2011

        they need to make a CLEAN SWEEP and fire all their asses.

  4. #9 by Jail Time on November 22, 2011

    I think the Gochenours need to get in touch with Mr. Mardirosian, stat.

  5. #10 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

    Yo Reality Is-when you arrest someone do u take their belt and give it back when out of the pokie?

    • #11 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      Yep. Take their belt and give it back when they walk out.

  6. #12 by fullerton lover on November 22, 2011

    Thank’s for the blast from the past Joe. I didn’t know this man personally, however I’ve heard from many credible friends that he was a good and honest person and that this was a complete cover-up by the FPD from top to bottom.
    I would hope that Gennaco and Company would make this case a priority and then start looking at Officer Perry Thayer’s pre-disposition to giving at least a dozen of our young men from Fullerton “screen tests”.
    For those of you uninformed bloggers that are unfamiliar with the term, a “screen test” is where the officer(s) handcuff the suspect and then drive the suspect around town while “checking their brakes” out. This in turn catapults the suspects face(s) into the screen/partion in the squad car that separates the oficers and the arrestees…hence the name “screen test”.
    If this is isn’t sick and deviant behavior, I’m not sure what is.

    • #13 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

      It takes a person of high moral character and dignity to do something like that.

  7. #14 by CackleFoos on November 22, 2011

    Fullerton PD is now Abu Ghraib West.

    Does anyone know if any of Fullerton’s Freaks were part of the Abu Ghraib scandal?

    • #15 by CackleFoos on November 22, 2011

      If anyone has forgotten how bad it was at Abu Ghraib, here are photos to remind you:

      http://antiwar.com/news/?articleid=2444

    • #16 by dixiejon on November 22, 2011

      Abu Ghraib head scum bag was a Pennsylvania corrections officer with numerous “unsustained” complaints against him.

      • #17 by CackleFoos on November 24, 2011

        Gee, that sounds familiar. Where have I heard that before?

  8. #18 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

    I am sincerely asking; How does one hang themselves in jail?
    It would seem to my uneducated mind that by now more steps would be taken to prevent such a thing.

    • #19 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

      My question is: how long of a belt would one need in order to tie it onto a rafter or overhead pipe and then into a loop around the neck?? Hmmmm…..

      • #20 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

        overhead pipe, rafter?
        I am not familiar with jail cells….how would someone even be able to climb up to a overhead pipe or rafter?

        • #21 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

          how can a drunk do that?
          ask that

          • #22 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

            Glad my PD has 47 cameras in the jails so any accusation or innuendo would be put to sleep right away if this happens.

            • #23 by dixiejon on November 22, 2011

              unless it’s real then all 49 cameras malfunction right?

              • #24 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

                Nope. Why would I want an officer working that will only make me or other officers look bad? Fire his ass. Liars are fired as soon as possible.

                • #25 by fullerton lover on November 22, 2011

                  My sentiments EXACTLY!

                • #26 by Broken Bones on November 22, 2011

                  Liars are not fired in Fullerton. As a matter of fact, Goodrich is perhaps the biggest liar in the entire police department and he’s their spokeshole.

            • #27 by nipsey on November 22, 2011

              Theo Lacy has lots of cameras too, which didn’t stop the Sheriffs on duty from pretending to not see stuff. I’m sure your guys get creative.

              • #28 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

                Nothing is possible. The cams in the station, property, jail, etc you can’t mess with. Locked inside a glass tube and downloaded 24 7 automatically.

                Car video is great too but the problem is it goes on when the light bar is activated. Would be nice to have 24 7 audio video in the field. Someday.

                • #29 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

                  “anything”

                • #30 by nipsey on November 22, 2011

                  Yes, someday perhaps mankind will have the technology to keep the camera running the whole time. Until then we can only dream.

                • #31 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

                  I’m trying to remember…didn’t Sheriff Arpaio have the jail cameras viewable by the public at one time?
                  What are your thoughts about the cameras being available in certain areas via live streaming?

      • #32 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        My guess. 30 inch belt would do the trick?

    • #33 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      Hangings happen often in jails. They happen in local jails, county jails, and state prisons. Research them. You would think it’s very hard to do but it’s actually very easy. They have sheets and they have bunks. That’s all it takes. I’ve seen them do it with less than that even.

      • #34 by dixiejon on November 23, 2011

        and it is always 100% the jailers responsibility.

  9. #35 by FU on November 22, 2011

    There’s a couple interesting comments from the story posted @ fullertonstories.com

    http://fullertonstories.com/suicide-at-the-fullerton-police-dept-jail/

    • #36 by Jane H on November 22, 2011

      Everything about the FPD is repugnant

      Something has to be done to reign in these latchkey adolescents–aka the FPD.

      Look at comment two in the Fullerton Stories. Police with no supervision is like leaving your kids home alone after school, or in the library. They do what they want and are not mature enough to have good judgment.

      _______________________________________________
      I’ve posted about this man before, and I think he sees the light. Read more if you are interested:

      http://www.thenation.com/article/164501/paramilitary-policing-seattle-occupy-wall-street

      Paramilitary Policing From Seattle to Occupy Wall Street
      Norm Stamper
      November 9, 2011

      “…Much of the problem is rooted in a rigid command-and-control hierarchy based on the military model…In the interest of “discipline,” too many police bosses treat their frontline officers as dependent children, which helps explain why many of them behave more like juvenile delinquents than mature, competent professionals. It also helps to explain why persistent, patterned misconduct, including racism, sexism, homophobia, brutality, perjury and corruption, do not go away, no matter how many blue-ribbon panels are commissioned or how much training is provided”.

      • #37 by Jane H on November 22, 2011

        I feel very sorry for this man’s ex-wife and daughter. They haven’t received enough information or any help whatsoever in their queries.

      • #38 by CackleFoos on November 22, 2011

        That’s a great article. It has the most common sense from a police professional as I’ve ever heard. I’m kind of surprised to hear him use the same analogies we’ve been expressing on this blog: out-of-control cops are like undisciplined children. A little tough love by some civilain oversight would go a long way to righting their reckless behavior.

        So why don’t cops simply pick up the protesters and carry them off like they used to? Sounds like the post 9/11militarization of police forces considers that too touchy-feely.

        • #39 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          I agree Cackle. Sounds easy. It’s not that easy. Go to You Tube and pull up all the latest videos. Or even the UC video. Picking up someone isn’t as easy as it sounds. It’s even harder when you are using 5 cops to pick up the person and another 20 cops to watch the rest of the group and another 100 cops to watch the 1000 people. I agree. Picking up and taking them to jail sounds easy and would be nice if it actually was that easy.

          • #40 by CackleFoos on November 22, 2011

            So what does using pepper spray accomplish? The victims are incapacitated and require medical attention. Cops used to pick up protestors all the time.

            I remember watching the Viet Nam war protests on the news with Chet Huntley and David Brinkley. They were newsmen, back in the day. Not the blow dried, bubble-headed bleach blondes you see now. And cars had fins!

            • #41 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

              I don’t think proper tactics were used. I think other alternatives should have been considered. I also think that school police don’t have enough training and experience in incidents like these.

              Pepper spray is my last option for anything. It’s messy and a big pain in the ass. I would use everything else almost before that. They don’t get medical attention, they just get their eyes flushed.

              It’s hard to monday morning quarterback certain things but the right thing to do is call in the 500 cops from the surrounding areas and handle the issue at hand. It’s very expensive, but it seems to be the way to go now. We are going to spend billions and billions and billions of dollars on cops overtime for the next few years on Occupy and other protests, so just call in the extra cops from the surrounding cities and counties, and handle the situation. 10 cops per person, 100-200 cops watching the group and take them out one at a time and book them.

              • #42 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

                Video of sh*theads like that Pike asshole inflame public sentiment and guarantee another confrontation. Seems like cops would eventually understand that, but of course it’s all a big pissing contest to them.

        • #43 by Jane H on November 22, 2011

          It is an excellent article. I was happy to find it.

  10. #44 by seer2some on November 22, 2011

    Councilman Whittaker said he was not given any information regarding this case when he asked for it. I definitely think something doesn’t sound right about this case……..

    • #45 by Tuco Ramirez on November 22, 2011

      Tuco says….
      I think Councilman Whitaker and the council lady could have requested more info through the City Manager and police chief. If nothing came through, a request for action by the city attorney. If he refuses, then you GO PUBLIC with the refusal of city employees to provide info to the city council. Of course, Tuco knows that the 3 blind mice vote it down, but you can only vote something down that is ON THE AGENDA! Thus it become public knowledge. A smart organization provides the info so things can be decided whether to make it public or not. You have a pow wow of all concerned. But the info is provided. I am personally getting tired of the Whitaker and Silva continual reply of they didn’t give me any info. You need to demand it and with teeth!

  11. #46 by FFFF spy van on November 22, 2011

    The old ffffffff spy van saw Chris Thompson picking up a boat load of pain killers the other day at CVS. Be careful driving, blogging and making up shit. Remember when the docs cut you off heroin will do in a pinch.

    • #47 by karma on November 22, 2011

      seriously? do you think posts like this work?

      Is that all you can come up with? You MUST be the Bushallaisapothead poster. (admin?)

      Transference much? sounds like you are the one on heroin.

    • #48 by truthseeker on November 22, 2011

      Hey spy van, how long did you work the lockers at Penn State? How was bohemian grove last July?

      • #49 by Peaches on November 22, 2011

        Bohemian Grove – there’s a name from the distant past! Do the movers and shakers (all men) still meet there annually?

      • #50 by Tuco Ramirez on November 22, 2011

        Spay van funniest post on here yet. Even dumb Tuco can read that you are one of Fullertons GED finest! Go donate some money to Ramos. He has 5 mouths to feed and no bucks comin in. You are gonna help him aren’t you?

    • #51 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

      lol @ spy van? shoot the moon!

      • #52 by truthseeker on November 22, 2011

        I knew I was right on

    • #53 by fullerton lover on November 22, 2011

      The prescription wasn’t for painkillers it was actually for hemrrhoidal creme to deal with pain in the ass stalkers like yourselves.
      If any of the anti-recall folks haven’t received the 411 yet, this recall is being supported by the overwhelming majority of Fullerton voters. The only exceptions that I’ve encountered are the Rotary Club members, as well as a few of the people that go to the same church.
      Of course the Police, Fire, and Public Employee’s unions also vehemently support these three councilman, however the overwhelming majority of their ranks do not live in Fullerton, and subsequently cannot vote to influence the outcome of the recall.

    • #54 by CackleFoos on November 22, 2011

      So now the McKinley goon squad is running political operations against someone who is expressing their constitutionally protected freedoms?

      Hey Special Ed, you nitwits tried that same MO at the Watergate Hotel, remember? Can ya tell us what happened from the fallout of that clusterfock? I won’t wait for your reply.

  12. #55 by Wrong Guy on November 22, 2011

    Sounds like FFFF spy van’s got a ‘hard on’ for Chris Thompson.
    Get over it boys, and start spying on FPD.

    • #56 by Lucky on November 22, 2011

      you got that right…fire all their asses and start over with men and women that have half a brain

      • #57 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        LOL

    • #58 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

      you dont get it do you.
      those spy van bozos are the fpd

      • #59 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        :)

    • #60 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

      No doubt they sit in their car and masturbate each other while thinking of ways to harass Chris.

  13. #61 by Wrong Guy on November 22, 2011

    who was the cop involved and what is his current employment status?

    Don’t know but I’ll bet you he was hired and trained by Kingpin Thug McKinley.

    • #62 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      I’ll bet the on duty cop wasn’t even in the building when it happened. Just a guess. Another guess is that he’s on full duty status and always has been.

    • #63 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

      Mater, he was fired because of it.

      • #64 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        Because if the suicide!? No way.

        • #65 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

          Destruction of evidence,fact!

          • #66 by Reality Is on November 23, 2011

            Nutty.

            • #67 by Broken Bones on November 23, 2011

              RI, “Nutty”? No. Welcome to Fullerton!

              I wonder is John & Ken know about this one? And how about David Begnaud with KTLA, I’m sure this would be news worthy to David, and how about Vicky Vargas, and…..

              • #68 by Broken Bones on November 23, 2011

                I wonder “if” John & Ken knows about this one “incident”?

  14. #69 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

    Reason TV should do a documentary on the darkness that is now overshadowing Fullerton!

  15. #70 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

    I would love to hear other theories on HOW it is possible for an individual to hang himself in a jail cell.

    • #71 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

      When I see death by hanging on TV the people usually are using a step stool or ladder so I am confused as to how someone can hang themselves in a cell as well.

    • #72 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

      if the bed is not bolted down or part of the floor, they use that to climb on. bed linens/clothing = rope. tie the “rope” to anything on the ceiling….smoke alarm, camera, intercom speaker, etc.

      • #73 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

        Okay, that would make sense. I was unaware of what was contained within a jail cell.

      • #74 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

        Um, if that was the case here; maybe in the future bolt down the bed or just put the mattress on a permanent fixture like raised poured concrete that creates a platform.

        • #75 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

          Interesting how they wouldn’t release any information to Bruce Whitaker.

    • #76 by Lucky on November 22, 2011

      ya’ll seem to keep using the terms “hang himself”…perhaps someone else hung him. then it’s highly possible. especially if there were no “witnesses” and as usual they covered it up. I wonder what church McKinley goes to.

      • #77 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

        mc’mick goes to the church of satan and is also a pedo!!!

      • #78 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        That’s more like the answer I would expect here. That someone murdered him.

    • #79 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      Google it. Happens all the time.

    • #80 by lolo on December 6, 2011

      Hung from the bars. There a bars that cross in front in jails. All people have to do is put their weight on whatever it was he hung himself from (shirt, belt, whatever) and drop rapidly. They have to really want to die though IF that’s how they hang themself because it’s easy to stand back up UNLESS they break their neck from the jerk of dropping down. Very bizarre that I know this.

  16. #81 by Jane H on November 22, 2011

    See how these trolls come out of the darkness when they are threatened?

  17. #82 by StormHarbor on November 22, 2011

    ‘The death was being investigated as a suicide with “no apparent suspicious circumstances,” Kandler said.’

    The LA Times reporter failed to mention that as soon as Kandler issued that statement, he uncrossed his fingers, pursed his lips for whistling and broke into a tune of “Old Dixie.”

    The District Attorney must investigate all in custody deaths. Since he represents the people, shouldn’t he issue a report detailing the scope of the investigation, facts surrounding the death and reasons he declined to prosecute anyone? So often the people’s right to know is blunted by the pretense of an investigation. Less often, the results of those investigations are prominently published.

    As an aside, there has to be consequences when police departments feed the public outright lies. When the dust finally settles in Fullerton, can Officer Goodrich really continue to be an effective information spokesperson?

    • #83 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      Just remember Storm. Goodrich says exactly what the Chief and the bosses tell him to say.

    • #84 by dixiejon on November 22, 2011

      keep him, know your enemy is good advice. you can count on a lie if he ever speaks and know the oppisite is true.

  18. #85 by Gag on November 22, 2011

    Wrong. Jail cells do not have overhead projections or pipes for that very reason.

    The lower bunks are concrete slabs; uppers are steel and welded to plates embedded in the walls.

    Most likely he used his shirt sleeve to asphyxiate himself.

  19. #86 by StormHarbor on November 22, 2011

    All the facts surrounding this suicide should come out satisfactorily. Say some patron of Fullerton’s plethora of beer gardens overindulges and finds the hand of an FPD officer holding his collar. An incentive for immediately surrendering is the underlying promise that he will be treated humanely while in custody and have his day in court. There may be much less incentive to surrender if he thinks he will be holed away as fodder for sport by demented jailers.

  20. #87 by Fafafuey on November 22, 2011

    Haha you fffer’s are at it again!!! You have no clue as to what you are talking about! As usual you ASSume and make shit up! Do you morons actually read the other posts and hear how idiotic you all sound? Wow it never seems to amaze me how stupid you ffffers really are! I am sure admin and is ass puppet are working on a story about the Fpd from 1940. I love how they bring all the old article and issues up because they have NOTHING else! Again way to stay off the reall issue morons! Admin and his ass puppet just keep playing you fffers! Haha

    • #88 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

      Yep, I’m told all the time that my IQ is not much higher than that of a brick!

    • #89 by StormHarbor on November 22, 2011

      You keep saying “you fffers.” Has it occurred to you that probably the most prolific commenter on this blog may just agree with your point of view? If you’re all agitated about made-up stuff, take a sedative and go check out the Anti-Recall website.

      • #90 by CackleFoos on November 22, 2011

        I think we should crash the Big City Cops blog and start posting piggish blather on their site, just like they’re doing here. Except Reality Is – at least his posts are coming from a brain that’s attached to a frontal lobe.

        • #91 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          Cackle. I am what I am. I say the truth. It really just allows you to get the perspective of a police officer with years of experience, and a police manager that deals with citizen’s daily also. As you know, you usually don’t get that ever. I mean where can you go to get the actual inside opinions of cops? No where. You might get a crock of BS but as an activist like yourself, you get that from me. I’m not here to piss anyone off. I enjoy the exchanges. I just think if activists open their minds just a little, they might learn something about the other side. Closed minds are worthless in this day and age.

          • #92 by Jane H on November 22, 2011

            “I enjoy the exchanges. I just think if activists open their minds just a little, they might learn something about the other side. Closed minds are worthless in this day and age.”

            Why do you think everyone who posts here is an activist? Some people are just disgusted with the current state of policing.

            • #93 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

              I think JFA is an activist. I think Tony is an activist. I think Chris is an activist. Most of the others are how you describe. Oh Xer is an activist too. :)

              • #94 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

                You made my day. I am really honored that you think I’m an activist; I’ve never been called that before, but I’ll accept it as a badge of honor that I shall cherish always. I’ll be happy to pass on your message to Xer. I can’t speak for Xer; however, I’m pretty sure he’ll feel very honored as well!

                As far as Tony and Chris- well, I’m also very honored to be mentioned in the same category with them! They are very civic minded and very interested and involved in local politics, which is something that every citizen should aspire to.

                Not nearly enough people accept their civic duty to be as involved in the community as Tony and Chris are. But, even more than that- Xer, Tony and Chris are all very compassionate human beings who DON’T laugh at, denigrate, or dehumanize those who suffer from mental illness.

                Instead, they strive to bring more awareness to the issues and to shine a bright light on evil and suffering. They work tirelessly to make changes within the community, in order to begin to right the wrongs that are so endemic. They spend their own personal money and invest their own personal time to do so. They don’t just accept the status quo, nor do they make excuses for it.

                I don’t feel worthy to receive your honor in the same category as Xer, Tony and Chris; however, I do humbly thank you.

                • #95 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

                  :) blush :)

              • #96 by Broken Bones on November 23, 2011

                Why did Dean Francis Gochenour “hang himself”?

                Why did Officer Mater intentionally break his DAR when asked to turn it over?

                Why did this incident go with NO public scrutiny?

                Why are we not being told the truth? Why I could also turn this question around and ask:

                Why did Sergeant Goodrich lie to the world when he said: “While trying to take Mr. Thomas into custody a fight broke out and two of the six arresting officers sustained broken bones during the fight with the suspected car burglar.

                Why, I could go on and on, but I wont, at least not now.

                Reality Is, am I an “activist” in your warped mind?

          • #97 by TheMoron on November 22, 2011

            With all due respect, I would like to at least give my humble view of your last post.

            Firstly, what you say is neither truthful nor non truthful. What you give is simply your opinion which you hold as truth. I welcome what you write as just that, your opinion. It is no more or less truthful than the other opinions on this board.

            Secondly, since you have refused to meet a few of the posters on this board who have extended a friendly hand to you in an offer to talk face to face, I have no idea whether you are a police officer or a school teacher. Therefore, no one can know the official position of this person called Reality Is. So how would one come to the conclusion that your opinion comes from any specific job you may or may not actually hold. Not that it matters, because you present your opinions in a cogent and grammatical manner that indicate you are an intelligent person. Again, since no one really knows who or what you are, your opinion comes from just another nameless, faceless blogger with no specific occupation.

            Thirdly, you are inferring that if anyone has a different opinion than those that you post, they are activist. I am not sure exactly what you mean by activist? Since you disagree with many, are you a non activist?

            Fourthly, I do enjoy exchanges myself and agree with some of the opinions that you present on this venue. But again, what you post is simply an opinion. It is neither right, wrong, factual or non factual, but simply your opinion.

            Lastly, I would offer that you open your mind to the other side of this board and you might find it is refreshing to at least consider other opinions that go counter to those you hold as truth. Again, their opinions are no more truthful or non truthful than yours but you may find some small areas of agreement.

            But, I am a person who believes in the constitution and those Americans who fought to preserve it, so I welcome reading your opinions. Keep posting them no matter if you are a law enforcement officer or a school teacher which makes no difference in the larger scheme of things.

            Maybe one day you and I could meet, shake hands and exchange conversation as fellow Americans, no matter who or what we are…………..

            • #98 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

              Thanks Moron.

              I agree. It is my opinion, but I also base my statements on years of education, training, and experience as well.

              True. I did get an offer. I was around there but at the time due to the hostility and having no balls, I didn’t feel it was the right thing to do.

              No. I specified the activists. Activists are much different than people with differing opinions. Activists don’t care what anyone says, what facts are brought forward, what research is done, or what conclusion is drawn. No matter what, anytime, anywhere, forever, it’s their way or the highway. Big difference. There are a few of those affiliated with ffff, but most are open to learning new things and the reasons things are done a certain way.

              I do open my mind. I have learned a ton from some of the people on here. Thats why I’m still here. My mind is always open. Here and as I walk the streets.

              Deal. :)

              • #99 by Justice for ALL on November 23, 2011

                I think you almost got it right. Since I am now a duly designated, and honored, “activist,” I will make some very important corrections for you. Other “activists” may also care to add their own corrections. Here goes:

                Activists don’t care to hear any more lies, half- truths and spin (from R.I., Goodrich, Sellers, McKinley, or anyone else), don’t believe that ALL the facts have ever been brought forward, don’t believe that your “research” is infallable, and we know better than to believe that your self-serving, unionized conclusions are drawn for the benefit of the public that you “serve and protect.” No matter what: anytime, anywhere, forever- it’s the American way to fearlessly march down every highway seeking to root out evil, corruption, injustice and oppression towards the helpless, the innocent, and every man, woman and child. There are many who are affiliated with FFFF who share these same values and ideals. Unfortunately, there also seem to be many apologists for corruption, abuse and murder within L.E. – from the upper management, all the way down to the lowliest beat cop. They will not cross the blue line-no matter what. They are not open to learning new things and the reasons why citizens will no longer tolerate all of the evil things that are done a certain way.

                There you go. By the way, thank you for my new official title. “Activist.” Very nice. I like the sound of that.

                • #100 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

                  Very nice, Justice for All. Being that I’m a designated “activist” too, I’d like to add my two cents worth.

                  I believe in the values espoused in our Constitution and Bill of Rights. I believe that government is supposed to serve the people, not the other way around. I believe it’s a citizen’s duty to report government actions that are criminal, immoral, or even decadent – it’s why this country split from King George’s tyranny.

                  If government resists change to bring it into line with Constitutional principles, activists become responsible for making those necessary changes. Activists of today are the true patriots, not some agency with an important sounding name that wiretaps its citizens secretly and indiscriminately, or spirits innocent people out of this or another country to have them tortured at the hands of foreign hacks because “we don’t torture.”

                  Activists are being sprayed in the face with a scalding mix of chemicals designed to inflict maximum pain because they’re trying to bring this country back to the principles it was founded on. And I’m proud of that fact that people who believe in the Constitution are still willing to sacrifice themselves to defend it.

                  No, I’m not an activist. I’m a coward. I’ve never marched. I’ve never stood up at a rally and done a mic check on Karl Rove or any of the other bastards who took us into war so their buddies could make a fortune. If I was 20 again and felt the way I do now you couldn’t keep me away from the front lines. I’d be in whatever Occupy group I could make it to. But I wouldn’t be a traitor. I wouldn’t sell my government’s secrets because of some perceived slight. I’d make sure the arrow I shot went straight to the heart of the corruption and killed it dead. And I’d rejoice to see the beast fall.

                  Everything I said referring to government applies to LE – they’re one and the same.

                • #101 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

                  (My original post disappeared – this is a repost.)

                  Very nice, Justice for All. Being that I’m a designated “activist” too, I’d like to add my two cents worth.

                  I believe in the values espoused in our Constitution and Bill of Rights. I believe that government is supposed to serve the people, not the other way around. I believe it’s a citizen’s duty to report government actions that are criminal, immoral, or even decadent – it’s why this country split from King George’s tyranny.

                  If government resists change to bring it into line with Constitutional principles, activists become responsible for making those necessary changes. Activists of today are the true patriots, not some agency with an important sounding name that wiretaps its citizens secretly and indiscriminately, or spirits innocent people out of this or another country to have them tortured at the hands of foreign hacks because “we don’t torture.”

                  Activists are being sprayed in the face with a scalding mix of chemicals designed to inflict maximum pain because they’re trying to bring this country back to the principles it was founded on. And I’m proud of that fact that people who believe in the Constitution are still willing to sacrifice themselves to defend it.

                  No, I’m not an activist. I’m a coward. I’ve never marched. I’ve never stood up at a rally and done a mic check on Karl Rove or any of the other bastards who took us into war so their buddies could make a fortune. If I was 20 again and felt the way I do now you couldn’t keep me away from the front lines. I’d be in whatever Occupy group I could make it to. But I wouldn’t be a traitor. I wouldn’t sell my government’s secrets because of some perceived slight. I’d make sure the arrow I shot went straight to the heart of the corruption and killed it dead. And I’d rejoice to see the beast fall.

                  Everything I said referring to government applies to LE – they’re one and the same.

                • #102 by Tuco Ramirez on November 23, 2011

                  Cackle is too windy. Tuco cannot read that much! Wow!

          • #103 by dixiejon on November 22, 2011

            i knew you would find a buddy if you kept saying how you’re really a great guy and not another weasel trying to get the inside track

            • #104 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

              :) :)
              :)

          • #105 by fullerton lover on November 23, 2011

            I honestly enjoy hearing your insight about police work, and your overall views that you share with us from your vantage point in law enforcement.
            I’ve personally found you to be very civil to exchange ideas with, and although I may not always agree with you Reality Is, I do appreciate you posting your thoughts and sharing them with the rest of us.

        • #106 by Jane H on November 22, 2011

          They’ll remove it. They don’t let anyone post who is not pro cop.

          • #107 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

            They’re also not bright enough to recognize a left-handed compliment. I know, because I’ve done it! lol!

  21. #108 by Walter F Starbuck, Jr on November 22, 2011

    We don’t need civilizen oversight of the PD, we need judical oversight. The Justice Dept needs to find such a pattern denying civil rights that a Federal judge is appointed to oversee the PD.

    Then, after the mutliple 7 & 8 figure settlements that will have to be made in the next few years; we will need to declare Bankruptcy.

    • #109 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      Good idea. They should have one oversee every PD. I would invite it. Problem is there is no money to do it. Every PD should open themselves up to any judge anytime. I think most PD’s would tell you go ahead. Most have nothing to hide. I think Fullerton PD would tell you the same thing. Then after that showed clean, you would blame the judge for being part of the coverup right? Just saying.

      • #110 by Walter F Starbuck, Jr on November 22, 2011

        I think its called a ‘consent decree’ a judge issues an order based on the PD consenting to the close oversight. I may be wrong-feel free to correct me on this.

  22. #111 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

    LOL :)

  23. #112 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

    Reality Is :LOL

    Exactly..you cant please no one on this blog. All negative!!

    • #113 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      I knew that long ago. Hard to please someone with a completely closed mind.

    • #114 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      Have you ever banged your head on the wall over and over and over?

    • #115 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

      QUOTE:
      “Exactly..you cant please no one on this blog. All negative!!”

      Oh, ok. I get it. You have a terminal setup in the day room at FPD jail. Inmates are encouraged to post anti-FFFF sentiments in return for reduced sentences. That explains most of the ridiculous bs coming from the pro-McKinley goobers on here.

  24. #116 by truthseeker on November 22, 2011

    Are there cameras in the jail?

    • #117 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      I have cameras in every jail area, jail cell, jail walk area, police car, police cage, police station, everywhere. I want cameras on every head too but that’s in progress. That’s a tough one due to the equipment and the downloads. Having a camera going 24 7 on every cop is almost impossible due to money for storage of data. But it’s the best thing. I have used camera recordings and audio recordings to prove the citizen a liar more times than I can count. Cameras are so valuable to the future of policing to benefit the cops it’s amazing.

      • #118 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

        “”"”"I have cameras in every jail area, jail cell…….”"”"

        “you” personally?… As in you are in a position of overseeing these things?

        • #119 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          Yes.

          • #120 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

            I thought so, is that how you seem know where I used to live?
            ……

            • #121 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

              Lol that made me laugh. Yes anonymous I know where you live lol. :)

              • #122 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

                “used to live”, read the post again…you mentioned in another post where I used to lived…I had never shared that so I thought it was odd when you mentioned Scottsdale, Arizona….

                • #123 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

                  Oh got it. Nope. I love Arizons. Just happened my wife was in Scottsdale when I typed that.

                • #124 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

                  got it…it’s a nice place.

  25. #125 by Wrong Guy on November 22, 2011

    Then why do the cops often get so upset when someone, ie, Any Joe Citizen video tapes them in action?

    • #126 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      I think cops get upset when people get in the way of them doing their duties while trying to video tape. Video all you want, but stand back. If I’m dealing with something you want to video, and you get so close, now I don’t know if you are going to get involved also so I’m trying to watch you and fight at the same time. Stand back and video away. Nothing worse than someone or some group videoing, yelling, making threats, moving closer, then getting mad when they are told to stand back. Yes you can video, no you can’t get so close as to interfere or cause a hazard to me. Make sense?

      • #127 by Wrong Guy on November 22, 2011

        Yes, I fully agree with that, however I still believe there are many hot-headed cops (that need a 26 week ‘Anger Management’ program) like Hampton that just ‘loose it’ when they are caught being videoed, regardless of distance or interference.
        Perhaps the simple presence of many citizens caused his paranoia which resulted in a false arrest, a rough-up, humiliation and I believe 5 months in jail for an innocent man. All because of ONE immoral cop and a corrupt police department and DA to falsly back him up. I’m so glad this one backfired.

        • #128 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          Me too. Very interesting case start to finish. That video is exactly what I’m talking about in terms of standing back. That yelling and screaming so close is so dangerous to everyone involved.

      • #129 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

        lol

      • #130 by nipsey on November 23, 2011

        Yeah they just don’t want you getting in their way, if by getting in their way you mean standing in your own driveway across the street.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-qWNqOjsW8

  26. #131 by Wrong Guy on November 22, 2011

    By the way, I heard there are areas in jails such as Norwalk, where there are no cameras in the locker areas, where they often take the mouthy out of control types and beat em up.

    • #132 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      10-20-30-40 years ago I think that happened often. I don’t think it happens much anymore.

      • #133 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

        so what is it piggie 10-20-30-40?
        or 50-60-70-80

        • #134 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          All of those. 80-90-100 too.

      • #135 by dixiejon on November 22, 2011

        happened last year at New Smyrna Beach Fla. Deputy Thibodeaux and a saergent beat a guy to stitches in the garage with guess what. no camera

  27. #136 by truthseeker on November 22, 2011

    Are there cameras in the Fullerton Jail?

    • #137 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

      Apparently, in L.A. there may be cameras, just NOT INSTALLED cameras.

      “In a searing self-critique, Los Angeles County Sheriff Lee Baca acknowledged that he was out of touch about problems in his jails and had failed to implement important reforms that could have minimized deputy brutality against inmates.”

      “Faced with an FBI investigation into the jail system and mounting criticism over his handling of the crisis, Baca said in a long interview with The Times that his command staff has at times left him in the dark about the jails’ woes.”

      “He noticed only during a recent visit to Men’s Central Jail that video cameras purchased more than a year ago to help monitor deputies and inmates had not been installed. The 69 cameras are still in boxes in a captain’s office. Baca has since committed to installing them by the end of the year.”
      http://articles.latimes.com/2011/oct/16/local/la-me-baca-jails-20111016

  28. #138 by Wrong Guy on November 22, 2011

    Sounds like do-nothing Baca has run out of excuses and is finally admitting something is wrong in his concrete concentration camp.
    He needs to go, like McKinley.
    I’d bet they’re good buds.

    • #139 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

      I wouldn’t be surprised at all to find out that they are good friends; they probably cry on each other’s shoulders every night. In any case, the protection of inmates has NOT been high on either of their priority lists.

      • #140 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        I don’t think inmates protection has been high on anyone’s list. Now some civil rights activists and attorneys see dollar signs and they are starting to bring things to the surface.

        • #141 by dixiejon on November 22, 2011

          quit being right

          • #142 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

            Ok

        • #143 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

          It’s about time.

        • #144 by Jane H on November 23, 2011

          That is a pretty cynical statement.

          • #145 by Jane H on November 23, 2011

            RI: “I don’t think inmates protection has been high on anyone’s list. Now some civil rights activists and attorneys see dollar signs and they are starting to bring things to the surface.”

            I meant that this statement is cynical.

            • #146 by Reality Is on November 23, 2011

              Cynical but true don’t you think?

    • #147 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      Too big of a department with not enough communication top to bottom.

  29. #148 by Erin on November 22, 2011

    Gennaco is reviewing everything within the walls of the FPD…

    • #149 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

      For what that will be worth….I’m not expecting much from him.

      • #150 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        I am. I think he’s good. I think you will be surprised.

    • #151 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

      Good! But let’s see what he actually reports.

    • #152 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

      http://www.lamag.com/features/story.aspx?ID=1515070

      Here is an excerpt from the Los Angeles Magazine article, and a comment that I copied from the Justice for Kelly Thomas Facebook page:

      “Michael Gennaco, the “independent” investigator hired by the FPD, has proven himself incapable of unbiased and thorough investigation, as evidenced by the numerous and glaring omissions (and his explanation of them) in his report on the Mitrice Richardson case.”

      When someone levels a serious complaint against the LASD, it’s often handled by the Office of Independent Review, a group of private contractor attorneys that reports to the county board of supervisors. Michael Gennaco was in his late forties when he was selected by the board in 2001 to head the new watchdog agency. Tall and soft-spoken, with short gray hair, Gennaco speaks with the specificity of the federal prosecutor he once was. Investigations of the LASD, he explained, are conducted by the LASD’s own Internal Affairs department. “Our bread-and-butter work,” he told me at the OIR’s offices in the City of Commerce, “is to ensure that the investigation that is done is a thorough investigation.” No Internal Affairs investigation of Mitrice’s arrest and release was ordered, however. Regardless of criticism of the sheriff’s department from the family, the public, and the press, “there really wasn’t a complaint or any allegation of violation of policy,” Gennaco told me. Instead of mandating a formal investigation, the OIR called for a “preliminary inquiry.”

      On July 9, 2010, one month before rangers found Mitrice’s body, Gennaco’s office issued a confidential report to the board. The 58-page document was leaked right after Mitrice’s remains were discovered. In it the OIR declares that Mitrice’s “questionable behavior included going to a restaurant, ordering a meal, parking valet, and leaving without a means to pay” but does not acknowledge Deputy Loureiro’s alleged remark about Mitrice’s “odd statements.” Rather, the OIR determines that the Lost Hills deputies didn’t endanger Mitrice by releasing her and cites the sheriff’s manual, which states, “Misdemeanor prisoners shall be released in the field whenever it is reasonable and safe to do so.” The report excludes two California penal codes about filing missing persons reports, one of which states, “it is the duty of all law enforcement agencies to immediately assist any person who is attempting to make a report of a missing person,” and the other of which states, “…the local police or sheriff’s department shall immediately take the report and make an assessment of reasonable steps to be taken to locate the person.” The latter code, in fact, requires even more stringent measures when it comes to missing persons who have no history of disappearing, are mentally unstable, or both. The OIR document also claims that Deputy Bomgardner “explained the procedures for filing a missing person report” to Latice. Of course, according to the audio released by the department, he simply told her that if she called back in a couple of hours, “maybe we can do something for you.”

      The omissions continue. The report doesn’t contain a word regarding Lieutenant Chew’s e-mail that says Deputy Loureiro felt Mitrice was acting unusual and that he was uneasy about letting her go. There’s nothing about how the jail cell video was in Captain Martin’s desk drawer for more than three months while he denied its existence. In response to suspicions voiced by Mitrice’s family about the footage, the OIR report concludes that the deputy seen leaving the building after Mitrice couldn’t have abducted her because he was on official business with his partner and because Mitrice was seen several hours later in Monte Nido, yet the passage accounts for only a few minutes of the whereabouts of the deputy and his partner on the day Mitrice disappeared.

      Despite a proclamation on page six that asserts “OIR played a multifaceted role in the review of the department’s actions,” the claim is accompanied by a footnote: “OIR did not conduct any interviews of the deputies and station jailer who had actual contact with Ms. Richardson on September 16 and 17, 2009, or who were involved in her being taken into custody or released from custody.” In other words, sheriff’s personnel got to choose what they handed over to the watchdog agency.

      After our first meeting, I called Gennaco and asked if he’d see me again to clarify parts of the report. “I can try and help,” he told me. “But some of it may be unclear—because it’s unclear!” He laughed. “Here’s one of the problems, of course. This was not written for the public. It was written for the board just as an update. It wasn’t intended to be particularly clear.” In our second meeting Gennaco couldn’t explain why so many details had been left out of the report that he’d approved and signed off on. He didn’t conduct the inquiry or write the document, he said. (The report’s author no longer works for the OIR; he didn’t respond to interview requests.) I mentioned the family’s concerns about the withheld video and the deputy in the footage. “Yeah, sure,” Gennaco said. Could the deputy and his partner, he continued, have “abducted Richardson on the road, taken her to a secluded area, dumped her, and then three days later taken her up to where she was eventually found? Anything’s possible. I mean, aliens coming down are possible! The mere fact that someone’s coming out the door shortly after somebody else means absolutely nothing to me! There’s no evidence that [they] didn’t do anything wrong. There’s no evidence that you didn’t!”

      Gennaco is right. The deputy at the door could have been pure coincidence and might not have even seen Mitrice. But, says Latice, “I’m entitled—as is the public—to a more thorough explanation than the one they provided, especially after being told that there was no video. If you consider how many other details they left out, it looks like a whitewash that lets LASD off the hook.”

      • #153 by cg on November 22, 2011

        Don’t know who you are, but you cleared the air. last night. I loved your debate with R.I. You made the things very clear. I love a great debate. R.I. needs to get more peeps. R.I. is sinking. Please debate again. RI is a blog of many cop faces. Shame on them.

        • #154 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          :)

          :)

  30. #155 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

    Reality Is :I think cops get upset when people get in the way of them doing their duties while trying to video tape. Video all you want, but stand back. If I’m dealing with something you want to video, and you get so close, now I don’t know if you are going to get involved also so I’m trying to watch you and fight at the same time. Stand back and video away. Nothing worse than someone or some group videoing, yelling, making threats, moving closer, then getting mad when they are told to stand back. Yes you can video, no you can’t get so close as to interfere or cause a hazard to me. Make sense?

    lololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololo0l0ololololololololololololololo

    • #156 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      :) :) :)

      • #157 by cg on November 22, 2011

        Is that all you have? Why don’t come forward? Or are all of you going stand behind star bucks? Why don’t all of you face your peeps.”The Residents of Fullerton” . We wiil support the ones with some sort of ethics.

        • #158 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          Face you and say what? Sorry it’s a tragic event. If someone did wrong they will be punished?

          • #159 by cg on November 22, 2011

            You are right, someone will be punished, but not all. I look for the the FPD to serve and protect. If those who don’t want to do this “go find another job. I am in a job that turning your co-worker for doing a bad thing, is good thing to do. It is calledd Ethics. Face me. I am just a humn.

            • #160 by cg on November 22, 2011

              sorry human

            • #161 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

              Understood. You are assuming that all these FPD cops have all this information on corruption and wrongdoing right? No one is going to go hold a press conference Monday morning quarterbacking that incident without being there and involved right?

              Just wondering what you would realistically expect people at FPD to come out and say right now.

              • #162 by fullerton lover on November 22, 2011

                “We’re sorry” sounds like a good place to start.

                • #163 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

                  Agree. It’s just not something you will see much anywhere for a variety of reasons. Involved personnel won’t say anything for legal reasons. Uninvolved personnel are out working and doing cop work. I think the most you would get is a Chief or PIO saying this was a tragic event and the family and friends are in our thoughts and prayers. That’s about the extent of it. No one can comment or make any statements because its a pending personnel case, possibly a criminal case, and possibly a civil case against the city (speaking in general about major incidents). I think the value of a press release or press conference is probably weighed against saying nothing, and nothing prevails.

              • #164 by cg on November 22, 2011

                No, there are always the bottom feeders. These are normal worker bees.

      • #165 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

        o.k. Reality,,,you’ve reached your quota on :) today!

        • #166 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          Can I work overtime? These nickels add up fast! :)

          • #167 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

            No, I cannot afford you. :)

  31. #168 by Erin on November 22, 2011

    Fullerton’s Proudest Disappointments at their finest.. Waste of citizens of Fullerton’s money..

  32. #169 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

    Tuco Ramirez :Spay van funniest post on here yet. Even dumb Tuco can read that you are one of Fullertons GED finest! Go donate some money to Ramos. He has 5 mouths to feed and no bucks comin in. You are gonna help him aren’t you?

    he can go on the dole. i feel no pitty for that cholo

  33. #170 by van get it da artiste on November 22, 2011

    I SUPPORT THE RECALL BECAUSE: it includes Pat McKinley,ex-member of Rusty Kennedy’s Orange County Human Relations Commission,whose polices and practices as Fullerton’s recently retired police chief created a police force that has no qualms about killing people then lying about it.

    • #171 by van get it da artiste on November 22, 2011

      policies

  34. #172 by Reality Isn't on November 22, 2011

    i say fuck that mick.
    Mc’Mick is should be recalled or will be recalled tor his incompetence alone!!!

  35. #173 by Fullerton on November 22, 2011

    Like Kelly Thomas, dead man cannot speak for himself and you will never find the truth from Fullerton police department and its henchmen.
    Everything is quietly fading away..Same process. Same brutality.

  36. #174 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

    Fullerton :
    Like Kelly Thomas, dead man cannot speak for himself and you will never find the truth from Fullerton police department and its henchmen.
    Everything is quietly fading away..Same process. Same brutality.

    And if I tell you there’s cheese on the Moon, bring crackers!!

  37. #175 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

    1F64F

    • #176 by One for the books on November 22, 2011

      Go ahead, 64F…

  38. #177 by TheMoron on November 22, 2011

    Reality Is :Agree. It’s just not something you will see much anywhere for a variety of reasons. Involved personnel won’t say anything for legal reasons. Uninvolved personnel are out working and doing cop work. I think the most you would get is a Chief or PIO saying this was a tragic event and the family and friends are in our thoughts and prayers. That’s about the extent of it. No one can comment or make any statements because its a pending personnel case, possibly a criminal case, and possibly a civil case against the city (speaking in general about major incidents). I think the value of a press release or press conference is probably weighed against saying nothing, and nothing prevails.

    Once again Reality……….. just your opinion which is no more or less truthful than anyone who disagrees with you.

    Since no one really knows if you are a school teacher or police officer, this opinion is coming from just another person who has no more knowledge of law enforcement or the law than anyone else who opines on this board.

    But keep your opinions coming, they are interesting.

    • #178 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

      True.

      Just saying how things like this are decided. That’s how I device them. That’s how the classes are taught related to PR of major incidents, and that’s how the police attorneys advise.

      :)

      • #179 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

        “That’s how I devise them.”
        As in ?
        What position would be able to “devise”?

        • #180 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

          Sorry. Advise.

          • #181 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

            O.K. I’ll bite …what position(s) advises…..
            multiple chioce is o.k. to throw out

            • #182 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

              Chief.
              Deputy Chief.
              Captain.
              Lieutenant.
              Sergeant.
              Corporal.
              Detective.
              Officer.

              Guess?

              • #183 by Anonymous on November 23, 2011

                How do you see it as fair to throw out that many choices?

                I’ll play anyway….I am guessing from reading your posts for some time now that you do have active role yet one of great influence…also appears you have a lot of time on your hands so I am narrowing my guess down to:

                Lieutenant
                Commander
                Deputy Chief
                Chief

                Warm or Cold?

                P.S. Have you noticed the :) are a great way to benchmark where the posts are that you want to keep track of? :)

                • #184 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

                  My money is on the one that was somehow left off the list: Explorer.

                • #185 by Justice for ALL on November 23, 2011

                  I think he is the very highly overpaid chief blogger/excuse maker, “Starbucks” seat warmer and donut runner.

  39. #186 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

    I don’t think he’s a liar. Just my guess. I think he was provided bad info to disperse.

    I really wonder where that statement came from though. I think Officers had to have gone to the hospital for some type of treatment. That’s the only plausible explanation. That two officers were treated for injuries related to the fight, but they didn’t end up with broken bones. Good question to get answered.

    If no officers were treated and in the report it says no officers had any injuries, then I would love to know where that statement came from.

    Keep in mind Goodrich just doesn’t walk out and speak on his own. He speaks when the Chief tells him too and says what the Chief tells him too.

    Broken Bones :
    Liars are not fired in Fullerton. As a matter of fact, Goodrich is perhaps the biggest liar in the entire police department and he’s their spokeshole.

    • #187 by cg on November 22, 2011

      I work with People like Goodrich, we in the private sector, call them ass kissers. Always laughed at and not respected. And it appears they are laughed at in your world too. All top brass needs a puppet. Looks like Goodrich know how to bend over the chiefs desk.

      • #188 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        Oink?

        • #189 by cg on November 22, 2011

          Persons like Goodhole, like it. Don’t know any better. Big ego, but no soul. How many of you cops laugh behind his back. I bet a lot. Normal for at work. We all laugh at the ones who are dumb asses. Give me a break, are you trying to tell me all of you, love each with love and kisses.That is BS. REAL WOULD

          • #190 by cg on November 22, 2011

            OOP! WORLD

  40. #191 by Anonymous on November 22, 2011

    Reality Isn’t :

    Tuco Ramirez :Spay van funniest post on here yet. Even dumb Tuco can read that you are one of Fullertons GED finest! Go donate some money to Ramos. He has 5 mouths to feed and no bucks comin in. You are gonna help him aren’t you?

    he can go on the dole. i feel no pitty for that cholo

    What the hell is a “dole” menso?

    • #192 by Peaches on November 23, 2011

      The “dole” is an old term for what we now call “welfare”; guess your GED history education is a bit lacking…

  41. #193 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

    Yes.

    In jails? Or public streets?

    Anonymous :
    I’m trying to remember…didn’t Sheriff Arpaio have the jail cameras viewable by the public at one time?
    What are your thoughts about the cameras being available in certain areas via live streaming?

    • #194 by Anonymous on November 24, 2011

      BOTH, I am all about transparency.

  42. #195 by streets of fullerton on November 22, 2011

    Two FPD followed ambulance to st. Judes tonight. I wonder what happened. Reminds me of the night of July 5th , When police escorted ambulance to St. Judes with KT.

    • #196 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

      I know exactly what you mean. Every time I hear a siren, I immediately think of the absolute horror that Kelly Thomas suffered the night he was murdered by our “finest public servants” who hide behind their badges. And, disgustingly, the list of “Kelly Thomas style murders” just keeps growing.

      • #197 by Reality Is on November 22, 2011

        Every time I read your posts I smile cause they are filled with so much sarcasm and BS. :)

        • #198 by Justice for ALL on November 22, 2011

          I meant every single word, and I was not being sarcastic at all.

  43. #199 by Fafafuey on November 23, 2011

    Jfo you are so dramatic! Get over it,everyone else has! Why don’t you go find some where to Occupy and waste your energy there!

    • #200 by Justice for ALL on November 23, 2011

      Death and murder IS pretty dramatic; wouldn’t you agree?

  44. #201 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

    Reality Is : You might get a crock of BS but as an activist like yourself, you get that from me.

    I too have never been called an activist. I have never participated in a demonstration, never advocated violence, never advocated the overthrow of the U.S. government.

    What I HAVE done is play the same psyops games against LE that they enjoy playing against citizens, I HAVE publicly stated my disdain for LE that are brutal thugs, and I HAVE enjoyed making government ops spend as much time and money going down rabbit holes as I can accomplish.

    But an activist? I’m thinking you’re confusing advocacy with activism. Free speech vs radical actions. It’s a common problem with LE today.

    • #202 by Jane H on November 23, 2011

      “But an activist? I’m thinking you’re confusing advocacy with activism. Free speech vs radical actions. It’s a common problem with LE today.”

      That is the crux of it.

      “Free speech vs radical actions”

      LE don’t like either, at least for the public.

      • #203 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

        Apparently they believe free speech IS radical action!

        • #204 by Donkey on November 23, 2011

          The LE RAGWUS believes any words belittling their cabal are unjust CackleFoos.

          These people clad in costumes, acting as the purveyors of p[eace are actually nothing but totalitarian monkeys beset upon the citizens by the political class that seek to control our lives with force.

          If the LE RAGWUS could cut off this website they would, for the simple fact that they hate hearing the truth about their evil organization. :)

          • #205 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

            I don’t doubt that for a second, Donkey. I see they’re putting a keystroke monitor on my computer. Here’s how to tell if a keystroke monitor is active: if you hold down the backspace key to erase several lines of text the cursor disappears while it’s backspacing, then when it reaches the end of where you’ve selected the entire block of text disappears simultaneously. As opposed to backspacing one character at a time as is normal.

            One way to defeat their malicious snooping is to install an IP Spoofer. I use Hide My IP. It costs for premium service but is free for basic. “They” are camping on my normal IP and blocking my posts to this blog. But when I switch to a spoofed IP they don’t know where I’m posting from. LOL!

            Poor little dears, they aren’t very bright.

          • #206 by CackleFoos on November 24, 2011

            “If the LE RAGWUS could cut off this website they would, for the simple fact that they hate hearing the truth about their evil organization”

            I have no doubt they would, Donkey. There’s probably a cabinet full of antacid tablets at FPD just because of this blog!

            • #207 by Reality Is on November 24, 2011

              Honest question.

              Do you really think more than 1, if that, of the Fullerton cops read this or care what anyone is saying?

              • #208 by CackleFoos on November 25, 2011

                You’re serious, right?

                I have absolutely no doubt that cops from Fullerton and other agencies come in here to primarily watch, but also to occasionally harass and intimidate. No doubt whatsoever.

                The LE mindset is based on controlling the citizen and to that end, at least in their mind, sniping with childish posts they think aren’t obvious to anyone is just another way they masturbate their ego.

                Bunny rabbits hiding behind a twig again.

                • #209 by Reality Is on November 29, 2011

                  Yea I’m serious.

                  That’s not why I come here and I really don’t think Fullerton cops care what FFFF says or even want to know what they say. Why would they? There is nothing positive here for them. Goes back to what I said before. You notice how quiet everything is? Mumbling and grumbling here but outside of this box it’s very quiet, business as usual. That’s why the say nothing tactic works in many aspects of life these days, politically and in public relations.

    • #210 by fullerton lover on November 23, 2011

      …well said mi amigo.

  45. #211 by seer2some on November 23, 2011

    An Officers act of courage, , something that all of us need to hear about with all the recent negative reports in the headlines….especially at this time of year……….

    http://www.ocregister.com/news/woman-328426-pulled-quesada.html

  46. #212 by No glow on November 23, 2011

    There are a lot of cameras in the Fullerton jail. I suspect the video shows the jailer escorting an intoxicated man to his single person cell with his issued blanket in his hand. Sometime later the video shows the jailer during his routine cell checks discovering the man with the blanket tied around the bars or the bunk hanging on his knees. The jailer opens the cell and calls the medics. The DA responses and conducts an investigation of an Orange County in custody death.

    Was not the first, sorry to say wont be the last.
    At least he did not take someone elses life when he chose to drive drunk.

    • #213 by Johnny Donut on November 23, 2011

      Does it show the jailer encouraging the man to kill himself?

  47. #214 by No glow on November 23, 2011

    Would you kill yourself if encouraged to do so?

    • #215 by nipsey on November 23, 2011

      If this actually works, I know a few people to try it on.

  48. #216 by No glow on November 23, 2011

    Orange County Jail has at least 5 of these a year. Fullerton Jail has had 1 in the past 10 years.

    • #217 by Johnny Donut on November 23, 2011

      Yeah, must be no big deal. Cops smash their DARs and destroy evidence all the time.

    • #218 by The Fullerton Harpoon on November 23, 2011

      How are we supposed to know that?

    • #220 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

      Looks like FPD is finally getting the press they deserve.

      • #221 by truthseeker on November 23, 2011

        No wonder they have the inverted perma frowns when they are on display up there.

        • #222 by CackleFoos on November 24, 2011

          They need to change their name. It’s now F*cked PD.

  49. #223 by No glow on November 23, 2011

    Johnny Donut
    Yeah, must be no big deal. Cops smash their DARs and destroy evidence all the time.

    I would have to disagree, if that happen “all the time” that would be bad. I think it would be a big deal and a department should take action if an investigation proved that occurred.

    • #224 by CackleFoos on November 23, 2011

      Quote:
      “I think it would be a big deal and a department should take action if an investigation proved that occurred.”

      It’s a big deal if you happen to live in the Bermuda Triangle or Area 51. Outside of Dreamland it’s business as usual.

  50. #225 by Anonymous on November 23, 2011

    CackleFoos :My money is on the one that was somehow left off the list: Explorer.

    He is hot for me.

  51. #226 by CackleFoos on November 24, 2011

    Tuco Ramirez :Cackle is too windy. Tuco cannot read that much! Wow!

    Tuco, there’s a great word in the dictionary – it’s spelled i-g-n-o-r-e. Works great for posts that have too many big words! lol!

  52. #227 by Justice for ALL on November 24, 2011

    Tuco Ramirez :
    Cackle is too windy. Tuco cannot read that much! Wow!

    Yes- you can, Tuco! Surely, Tuco knows…the more you practice, the easier it gets. You’ve written some fairly long comments yourself in the past; I have complete faith in you. Besides, if you don’t read what Cackle has to say, you’ll be missing out on some seriously great posts!

    Happy Thanksgiving everyone!! If you are able, remember to take some of your extra food to the homeless. Just ask them if they are hungry, or if they have eaten today. They do appreciate hot food so much, especially on these cold days and nights. Many times, you will find that they go to sleep hungry.

    Not all of the homeless are mentally well enough to be able to find their way to a soup kitchen/shelter/etc. The mentally ill very often are not able to think clearly enough to follow directions, ride a bus, remember instructions, remember what day it is, remember to come in out of the rain and they often can’t figure out how to get help, etc.

    I know of one young mentally ill guy (in a different city) who has Crohn’s Disease and the shelter won’t let him go inside because of his diarrhea! Therefore, he sleeps in doorways on the ground on top of a piece of cardboard. The officer won’t transport him to the hospital for a 5150 evaluation because the officer states that the mentally ill young man sleeps on a small piece of cardboard, instead of on the bare cement.

    The mentally ill and the homeless need our help, understanding and love.

    If you can, you might consider buying a homeless, mentally ill person a pair of waterproof hiking boots for the rainy weather (the Itasca brand hiking boot is really good (waterproof) and they are on sale for only about $20 at Big 5 this week, until the 27th as I recall. I also spray them with an extra coat of waterproofing spray (and then let dry for 48 hours) that you can purchase in the camping section of most stores. Or, perhaps buy someone a waterproof coat. Help them if you can.

    • #228 by Reality Is on November 24, 2011

      I had a homeless mentally ill guy come to the PD station door the other night. He was yelling and screaming and jumping up and down. I was watching him on video.

      Turned out to be a loal that was hit by a car and his leg almost severed off about 6 months ago. Surprised at his recovery.

      I opened the door and we entertained each other for a few minutes. I had the same voice level as he did and talked about things like the flower on his head or his leg.

      He was mad because his home, shopping cart and blankets, we’re wet. He said all he needed was 50 cents and he would be on his way. I said that’s it? 50 cents? I said how about $5? His face lit up like huh?

      I went and got $5 and he left smiling and laughing as he pushed his cart down the street.

      All on video. :)

      • #229 by CackleFoos on November 24, 2011

        Great posts from both of you. Thanks for sharing that.

  53. #230 by Elaine P on November 24, 2011

    Investigate the Orange County Coroner!

  54. #231 by LT on November 29, 2011

    Reality Is :
    Yea I’m serious.
    …Mumbling and grumbling here but outside of this box it’s very quiet, business as usual. That’s why the say nothing tactic works in many aspects of life these days, politically and in public relations.

    I don’t think it’s very quiet outside here. Obviously you have not recently been to a Market, Post Office, Starbucks, Train Station, McD’s, etc. in Fullerton. There’s a recall going on and your three blind fish are flopping on dry land.

    When it was time for leadership, your buddies tails went between the leg and “saying nothing” was not an option.

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